Maui Wildfires [Archive] - Colorado AR-15 Shooters Club Discussion Forums

Martinjmpr

08-10-2023, 07:28

Lahaina, Hawaii, residents share harrowing escape from devastating wildfires: 'Everything is gone' (yahoo.com) (https://www.yahoo.com/news/lahaina-hawaii-residents-share-harrowing-024930546.html)

And the flames grew much faster than anyone could have imagined (https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/08/09/how-did-the-maui-fires-start-human-habitation-may-be-partly-to-blame/70559241007/). In a few hours, the wind-driven blaze tore through popular Front Street and decimated a town center that traced its roots to the 1700s and was on the National Register of Historic Places.

This is just heartbreaking. We were in Lahaina last November, looks like the historic downtown district is gone. I presume the huge Banyan tree also burned up. And even more tragically, 36 confirmed dead which just goes to show what happens when a wildfire hits a populated place like this.

I didn't even know they had wildfires in Hawaii, I figured it was too wet, but apparently it's been quite dry there for a long time and when the winds kicked up, it just exploded.

ruthabagah

08-10-2023, 07:58

So sad…. This part of Maui is pretty dry compared to the rest.

flogger

08-10-2023, 18:43

I was fortunate enough to work in Maui a half a dozen times remodeling a house my sister-in-law purchased in Kihei, which is south of Lahaina some 35 miles. My niece worked at Pacific Whale Foundation, they do Whale watching tours and snorkel trips around the area. They have a 'slip' at Lahaina and Maalaea (one of the windiest harbors on earth). Lahaina is always dry and hot compared to the southern areas around Hana. So much history there and the Bayan tree is a big part of it. Many very upscale shops in the area, one was a vintage poster shop ($$$ nice stuff) that I can only imagine the loss.

Very tough situation for everyone there. Fires are still threatening south Maui and the impact on tourism will last a while. Of course, they are blaming it on climate change.

.

O2HeN2

08-11-2023, 15:45

The old part of Lahaina is similar to the old wood towns of Nome and Cripple Creek. It's almost a case of when, not if, they burn.

..lived on Maui for two years back in the 70s.

Lack of cell phone service on the island is the strongest case for getting your ham Technician license I've seen in awhile.

O2

Jer

08-11-2023, 16:37

Super sad. We've got some friends from there who still have family back there. Fortunately, they're all safe but it sounds like they're not quite out of the woods so-to-speak yet. Maui is one of our favorite places on earth and the devastation is going to cripple that economy for the foreseeable future, unfortunately. It's crazy how much the islands depend on tourism to get by. We had a trip planned for Kuai the week after the big floods a few years back. We were going to cancel but then saw a news spot where they were basically begging people to visit. They said it was bad enough that some lost their homes and now they might lose their jobs too. Maui is similar in this respect. Hopefully those who had trips planned still go, if it's safe to do so.

BladesNBarrels

08-11-2023, 16:49

....We were going to cancel but then saw a news spot where they were basically begging people to visit. They said it was bad enough that some lost their homes and now they might lose their jobs too. Maui is similar in this respect. Hopefully those who had trips planned still go, if it's safe to do so.

The CBS reports were that so many people were displaced that there will not be accommodations for tourists for quite a long time and that the economy is going to suffer without the tourists.
But....FEMA is on the ground and requesting everyone to get registered.

Jer

08-11-2023, 16:54

The CBS reports were that so many people were displaced that there will not be accommodations for tourists for quite a long time and that the economy is going to suffer without the tourists.
But....FEMA is on the ground and requesting everyone to get registered.

I had a feeling that would be the case for the foreseeable future given the circumstances based on what I've seen/heard to this point.

O2HeN2

08-12-2023, 14:17

My lefty friends in Hawaii always tell me how well gun control works in the islands.

Everyone over there is going to get a lesson in just how fragile "civilization" is.

I have a feeling that a second disaster - trying to reclaim parts of the island from the gangs - is on the horizon.

...not to mention rebooting the tourist industry after this.

94465

Bailey Guns

08-13-2023, 06:53

Maybe I'm ignorant of the platform she's using but if there's no internet how was that message posted?

O2HeN2

08-13-2023, 09:22

Maybe I'm ignorant of the platform she's using but if there's no internet how was that message posted?

Probably the same way my friend on Maui posted it on Facebook. They're not in the affected areas when posting (Wailuku, in the case of my friend and if my memory serves), and it's the affected areas that lack communication and the inability to call the cops - the fact that they probably won't come aside...

O2

Aloha_Shooter

08-13-2023, 20:06

It looks like the banyan tree may have survived and even if the main tree has to be taken down for safety there are likely underground shoots that will come back in time.

This presents Lahaina with an opportunity to rebuild in a way they never could before, hopefully preserving the essential character of the town while making the utilities more resilient and the buildings more robust.

What really disturbs me are the reports that the civil defense or emergency management sirens didn't go off. The death toll is likely where it is (89 the last time I checked and probably going up) because residents didn't get a warning. My father worked for Civil Defense when he retired from the Air Force and I don't believe a situation with inoperative sirens would have been tolerated back then. We heard them monthly like clockwork in Honolulu in the 70s and 80s; Lahaina is seaside and those sirens are needed for tsunami warning (among other things). I hope the reports are wrong and that people just didn't hear them because they were isolated in their air-conditioned and sound-proofed rooms or plugged into their iBuds.

BladesNBarrels

08-14-2023, 15:16

Looks like the AG is starting an investigation of why the sirens and alert messages were not sent out.

I am glad the Banyan Tree survived. Maybe it is like the Redwoods in California where they have some fire retardant ability.

I, too, am hopeful that the rebuilding effort modernizes and still maintains the historical feel. But, as we are learning from the Marshall Fire, there will probably be all kinds of conflicts.

Aloha_Shooter

08-15-2023, 07:36

Maui police suspend placard program after ‘non-essential’ people flood distribution sites
https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/2023/08/14/mpd-access-placards-be-required-order-travel-into-west-maui/

Just hours after launching it, Maui police have suspended a placard program designed to speed up access into West Maui after distribution areas were flooded with people.

Maui police said they saw “overwhelming demand” from non-essential people and visitors.

Video shot by Hawaii News Now shows hundreds of cars lined up for the distribution areas.

We really get to see who people are in a disaster. The few angels show themselves and the many demons also shed their disguises.

‘A gunfight without bullets’: Firefighters faced down blaze with dry hydrants
https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/2023/08/15/gunfight-without-bullets-firefighters-faced-down-blaze-with-dry-hydrants-no-communications/

Firefighters on the front line in Lahaina are telling harrowing stories of watching their own town burn — while the water ran out and they were forced to flee.

The stories are coming out through their union leaders, who are trying to make sure they have the continuing support they need.

Fire Fighters Association President Bobby Lee said he and two executives of the International union toured Lahaina and met with Maui firefighters on Sunday.

“Our resources were pretty much overwhelmed,” Lee said.

The leaders said the firefighters described the wind-driven fires bearing down on Lahaina as being like a blowtorch — 25 to 30 firefighters were staring down the flames as their hydrants went dry.

The bureaucrats are going to face some public wrath after this. Unbelievable what wasn't working right.

theGinsue

08-15-2023, 10:21

The bureaucrats are going to face some public wrath after this. Unbelievable what wasn't working right.

Boy, oh boy do I hope that they do. But, people's memory is very short and easily distracted, even from righteous indignation.

I've never been to any part of Hawaii. I want to go, just haven't. I think of Hawaii as "paradise", but the truth is it isn't immune from the same greedy leadership we see throughout our country. Just like I see happening day-to-day here in Colorado Springs and CO in totale, I'm sure bureaucrats in Maui redirected tax revenue for essential services to pet projects and to lining their own pockets. After all, "what are the chances something drastic would ever occur?". Well, it has occurred and now the people of Maui are paying the price for their bureaucrats poor decisions. These poor decisions not only resulted in loss of structures, but of lives as well. FULL accountability (to the extent of prison time) needs to happen. Hopefully the people of Maui will go after those responsible with every ounce of their energy and won't allow themselves to be distracted by the next "shiny object" flashed before their eyes.

Joe_K

08-15-2023, 17:16

Up to 99 dead, and still searching the burn areas. Praying that number doesn?t get higher. Still wondering what started the initial blaze. Other side of the island last year these 3 were lighting fires to quote avoid going to jail end quote. https://www.mauinews.com/news/local-news/2022/05/suspects-in-suspicious-brush-fires-charged-with-arson/

.455_Hunter

08-15-2023, 17:53

flogger

08-16-2023, 20:59

Really sad all the way around, power down, no fricking sirens (the same ones they test every month), and a real test of the first responders. Too much, too fast, thanks to the weather and wind. They have done their best in my opinion.

Not a good sign when you are asked to give a DNA example when submitting a missing person's report. Just heart-breaking to even imagine.

.455_Hunter

08-16-2023, 23:15

The fact that the missing list is still around 1000 this many days after the event is highly concerning. The eventual death toll could be unprecedented in modern US history for a wildfire event.

O2HeN2

08-16-2023, 23:31

A disturbing observation I read was that because school was not yet in session, there were many latchkey children at home in the Lahaina area.

O2

buffalobo

08-17-2023, 10:00

Needs to be investigation of Herman Andaya and those responsible for hiring him.

If you're unarmed, you are a victim.

RblDiver

08-17-2023, 13:32

This guy should be held liable for not releasing water to fight the fires when it was still possible.
https://notthebee.com/article/this-is-the-equity-obsessed-water-resource-official-who-refused-to-release-water-to-fight-the-maui-wildfires-until-it-was-too-late

Aloha_Shooter

08-17-2023, 23:36

The Emergency Management chief is trying to defend not using the sirens. His claim is that people would have headed inland into the fire because they were used to the siren indicating tsunamis. It's been a long time since I've listened to the sirens there but I could have sworn tsunami and hurricane each had their own specific patterns which was separate from the general alarm. In any event, I don't believe the people would be stupid enough to go fleeing into a black cloud of smoke and flames.

O2HeN2

08-17-2023, 23:49

I wonder if the sirens are in fact sirens or speakers. Speakers are mostly used nowadays so sirens can be tailored to the threat.

It allows Cannon Beach's Cannon Ocean Warning System (COWS) to moo when it's tested.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oq8X643v-O8

O2

buffalobo

08-18-2023, 19:42

Many stats do not add up. Death toll vs still missing vs areas searched and yet to be searched.

If you're unarmed, you are a victim.

BushMasterBoy

08-18-2023, 20:30

Biden is on his way to Maui to assess the damage. That is all they need to tie up resources necessary to provide locals relief. Just the fuel bill for AF1 is enough to buy someone there a new house. Just more waste.

Aloha_Shooter

08-19-2023, 08:38

Biden is on his way there because he got a lot of deserved shit for his "no comment" when asked about Maui as he was relaxing on the beach.

I'm not surpised at the still high "missing" count as fast as the wildfire is reported to have spread and considering how the structures in downtown Lahaina were basically tinder. Recovery operations are going to take some time.

O2HeN2

08-19-2023, 08:59

Also sounds like folks that live there are begging tourists to come to keep the economy alive, while at the same time other locals are punishing tourists for being there at this "sensitive time."

O2

Singlestack

08-19-2023, 10:51

You should be able to get a screaming deal on a Kaanapaali hotel this fall. Kaanapaali Marriott was my honeymoon

flogger

08-19-2023, 17:53

Many stats do not add up. Death toll vs still missing vs areas searched and yet to be searched.

If you're unarmed, you are a victim.

I have heard the fire was hot enough in areas to incinerate a body. That ash you are stepping on might not be from the burned-out carport or business entrance. The ID of victims might never be complete.

Really bad situation all around. That island survives by tourism, lots of places to visit beyond Lahaina, but the population is in shock and mourning. I think that will take some time.

Hopefully, the residence will take notice and realize that maybe a Democratic Party run government (too long, too many problems) might not be the answer. My relatives that live there are die hard Libs, maybe not anymore. As far as President Mumbles planned visit? He's f-cked, people will remember this!

BREATHER

08-20-2023, 06:47

No they won't libs do not remember, they just want want want

eddiememphis

08-20-2023, 08:20

I have never understood politicians visiting disaster areas.

President Biden said he did not want to go and be in the way. Mike Huckabee says this,

"The president doesn't get in the way when he goes to a natural disaster or any kind of disaster," Huckabee told Hannity."In the same way that presidents and governors go to the point where people are hurting in mass."

"You show up for two reasons. One, because you legitimately want to put your arms around those people who are left and hurting and show on behalf of all of the people that there is genuine concern," the former governor continued. "And the second reason, when the chief executive shows up, you know who else shows up? Everybody in the press. They keep attention focused on those most in need."

When one is the victim of a disaster, does a politician "showing concern" matter as much is trying to repair the damage caused and get your life back in order?

Politicians, claiming that they care has always seemed disingenuous to me. Especially since it always happens in front of a lot of cameras and microphones.

eddiememphis

08-21-2023, 18:05

I was cleaning my 1911 this afternoon and turned on the youtube to watch live coverage of the President's visit.

President Biden is in bad shape, both mentally and physically. There is no way the Democrats allow him to run again.

The Governor of Hawaii cried.

Maizey Hirono is a fool.

The overwhelming theme of all the speeches from the politicians was the urgent need for Federal money.

arbol

08-21-2023, 18:09

I'm trying to get up the courage to look and see if my Maui friends/acquaintances are still posting on facebook. I mean, I am pretty sure they are, but what if they aren't?

-John

theGinsue

08-21-2023, 18:26

Maybe I missed it or have just forgotten already, but do we know the cause of this wildfire?

Federal money. Makes everyone's pain go away - except the taxpayers.

arbol

08-21-2023, 18:34

I think the architecture in the area was primitive (wood), and once set ablaze, high winds spread the flames.

-John

RblDiver

08-22-2023, 00:47

My understanding is that the immediate cause was old power lines in disrepair, plus very dry area, old wood buildings, high winds, etc.

BPTactical

08-22-2023, 05:58

Oh look, FJB is here to save the day
https://twitter.com/MattWallace888/status/1693778794648162497

BushMasterBoy

08-22-2023, 10:30

Single family homes are super expensive in Lahaina.

https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-search/Lahaina_HI/type-single-family-home/pg-1

BPTactical

08-22-2023, 11:06

Single family homes are super expensive in Lahaina.

https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-search/Lahaina_HI/type-single-family-home/pg-1

They need to rename that area to "Kumoniwaanaphuckya"

BushMasterBoy

08-22-2023, 17:02

https://nypost.com/2023/08/22/biden-faces-backlash-for-dog-boot-joke-in-maui-hot-ground/

"President Biden is facing brutal backlash for a quip about a Maui cadaver dog that went viral just hours into his disastrous visit to the site of the deadly wildfires ? with critics blasting his ill-timed attempts at comic relief as ?poor taste.?

flogger

08-22-2023, 17:49

https://www.msn.com/en-us/travel/news/tone-deaf-fema-officials-slammed-for-living-in-luxury-hotels-as-maui-residents-remain-shattered-and-homeless/ar-AA1fDfq3?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=7ae05d77138f42aabad3925468802f20&ei=24

Our government is completely clueless or extremely stupid!

Do you really think no one will pick up on this? Living in luxury when you clowns are there to help people out. Disgusting, you jerk-offs are showing your ignorance just like your feeble leader.

If I were a resident of Maui (and especially Lahaina) I would be up in arms.