Men should get a say!

[Ronin13]

So this debate came up the other day with some female friends of mine- after I quoted Ronald Reagan: “I’ve noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born.” Well they said that it shouldn't be .gov's decision but the woman's decision. I interjected with "Yes, but the woman should get her male partner's input before making that decision, thus the decision should be a couple's decision, not solely the woman's." They were all over me after that telling me that "Men don't have to carry the baby for 9 mos," and crap like that. While true, it takes two to make a baby, and the man should get a say. Maybe not 50/50 but at least 45/65. If I was with a woman (long term hopefully) and she got preggers I'd want to have a say in where we go from there. Granted I'm against abortion and think adoption is a perfectly good alternative, but there are a few cases (rape, incest, threat to life) where I'd accept it, but it's all case by case. If my girl decided to have an abortion and not include me in the decision, guess what? she's getting a nice swift kick to the curb (figuratively) and I'm done with her.
Thoughts?

[DANGERTASTIC!]

Its their sense of entitlement since they are the ones doing all the "work" figuratively speaking, meaning they have to carry the baby.

I agree, I was with a girl for a few years when I was 22, she always said that if I got her pregnant that she would have an abortion, I believed her due to the fact she had done the same thing with the guy before me.

It used to give me nightmares and wake me up. What a bitch

[hollohas]

Agreed. Dad's should have equal say. In fact, I would say that a Dad should be able to press charges against the Mom if she has an abortion of his child without his consent.

I had a buddy that got a girl pregnant. She decided she wanted to give the child up for adoption while the Dad wanted to keep it. He wanted to raise his daughter even if the Mom didn't want to be involved. He asked nothing of the Mom. No child support, no time, nothing. He just wanted to be a Man and raise the child he made even if it wasn't in his plan. But the court said "no". The Dad was not given custody and his child was given away to another person the second she was born. That's fucked. His girl was taken from him forever. He had no rights, the Mom had them all.

It takes two to make a child. But only one gets the rights. Bullshit.

Abortion without the Dad's consent is kind of like that story but 100% worse.

Full disclosure. I'm a Dad and I'm against convenience abortions. Plain and simple murder in my book.

[Ronin13]

Agreed. Dad's should have equal say. In fact, I would say that a Dad should be able to press charges against the Mom if she has an abortion of his child without his consent.

I had a buddy that got a girl pregnant. She decided she wanted to give the child up for adoption while the Dad wanted to keep it. He wanted to raise his daughter even if the Mom didn't want to be involved. He asked nothing of the Mom. No child support, no time, nothing. He just wanted to be a Man and raise the child he made even if it wasn't in his plan. But the court said "no". The Dad was not given custody and his child was given away to another person the second she was born. That's fucked. His girl was taken from him forever. He had no rights, the Mom had them all.

It takes two to make a child. But only one gets the rights. Bullshit.

Abortion without the Dad's consent is kind of like that story but 100% worse.

Full disclosure. I'm a Dad and I'm against convenience abortions. Plain and simple murder in my book.

Gosh, we see eye to eye alot! I have a buddy who got a girl pregnant, she had the kid after they broke up, but she denied him any custody or visitation rights for the child (and a whole mess of false charges brought up against him), so basically she screwed him over and now he'll never know his son... I think women are more capable of insidious evil than men ever will because of that little powerful thing between their legs. Luckily most don't act on the evil capabilities... also, one thing that plagues me- similar note- is because it happened to a friend's brother. Short story: guy meets girl, sleeps with girl (consensual), girl next day regrets it and screams rape. Guy does 15yrs in prison. If that ever happened to me, guaranteed I'd be in a non extradition country right after the verdict was read (if I could get away) or I'd just find the meanest blackest dude first day in and make sure I was hated enough to be killed- I wouldn't want to survive to become an ex-con.

[DANGERTASTIC!]

Im with you guys all the way, My girl had a friend in high school, her parents were fucks and controlled her life, (everyone knows what happens when you do that) so one night shes at a party and bangs some dude.

The next day her parents find out their little "Angel" opened her legs up and to avoid getting in trouble she told them he raped her. He just got out in Feb. after being locked up for the past 11 years, he's a registered sex offender and cant live anywhere near a church or school.

I hope that bitch gets what she deserves. The part I LOVE the most about people like that, is when somethin shitty happens in their life an they ask "What did I do to deserve this???"

Anyway, I grew up with a pile of shit dad that was no where to be found, he made an effort when I was 8 and I met my 3 "Sisters" and his wife. He promised me he would call and make an effort. Again at 12, and the first time I had heard from him since I was 8, he promised the same shit and fed me crap. Not a word till I was 18 he tried again, I told him to fuck himself, now, he has 4 daughters and a son (not including me) and doesnt have anything to do with any of them.

4 years ago I got my girlfriend at the time pregnant, I was pretty happy about it. I was gonna man up at prove to myself I was NOTHING like my "Dad". We lost it.

Why is it that the biggest pieces of shit can knock every girl up and not take care of their responsibilities but someone with good intentions cant even have the opprotunity?

[alan0269]

I would have to agree that no matter what the woman decides to do, she should discuss it with the man involved. Ultimately, she could do whatever she wants without consulting the man, but she should have the common courtesy to at least have the conversation with him. I've heard stories of a woman having an abortion because she thought the man she was with will be scared off because he doesn't want to have kids, to just find out later that he does. A couple I know was in that situation, and now that they are married and have two kids, she still regrets the decision she made back then.

[Delfuego]

Men don't carry a baby for 9 months, but they are required to support that baby for 18 years....

[bobbyfairbanks]

So this debate came up the other day with some female friends of mine- after I quoted Ronald Reagan: “I’ve noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born.” Well they said that it shouldn't be .gov's decision but the woman's decision. I interjected with "Yes, but the woman should get her male partner's input before making that decision, thus the decision should be a couple's decision, not solely the woman's." They were all over me after that telling me that "Men don't have to carry the baby for 9 mos," and crap like that. While true, it takes two to make a baby, and the man should get a say. Maybe not 50/50 but at least 45/65. If I was with a woman (long term hopefully) and she got preggers I'd want to have a say in where we go from there. Granted I'm against abortion and think adoption is a perfectly good alternative, but there are a few cases (rape, incest, threat to life) where I'd accept it, but it's all case by case. If my girl decided to have an abortion and not include me in the decision, guess what? she's getting a nice swift kick to the curb (figuratively) and I'm done with her.
Thoughts?


You said preggers. turn in your man card.

[DANGERTASTIC!]

You said preggers. turn in your man card.

[ROFL1]

[mevshooter]

My wife and I had our first child, a girl, 4 months ago, and it is pretty much the greatest thing ever. I fall more in love with that beautiful baby girl everyday.

I'm 100% against abortion, and I can't stand dead beat parents.

What irritates me is. Guy wants to have baby, girl doesn't, baby is gone.

Guy doesn't want to have baby or have anything to do with baby, girl does, guy is financially responsible until the child is 19 (in Colorado).

How the hell does that make sense?

Don't get me wrong, I think people need to man up and take care of their responsibilities, but what an ass backwards law. For a society that "treats women so badly" and women "don't have an equal say in the workforce or government" the laws SURE DO side with them on almost everything.

[DANGERTASTIC!]

Guy doesn't want to have baby or have anything to do with baby, girl does, guy is financially responsible until the child is 19 (in Colorado).

How the hell does that make sense?.

Like I said in my earlier post, its the womens sense of entitlement.

They feel like they are "Owed". How else are they gonna take care of a baby and still buy their clothes and shop and go out to the bars with their friends?

[mcantar18c]

+1 to just about everything in this thread.


4 years ago I got my girlfriend at the time pregnant, I was pretty happy about it. I was gonna man up at prove to myself I was NOTHING like my "Dad". We lost it.
Sorry to hear man. Pretty much the same situation here, almost 5 years ago though.

Men don't carry a baby for 9 months, but they are required to support that baby for 18 years....
Was gonna post this [Beer]

[glock74]

I agree with Ronin13.

[Ronin13]

Like I said in my earlier post, its the womens sense of entitlement.

They feel like they are "Owed". How else are they gonna take care of a baby and still buy their clothes and shop and go out to the bars with their friends?

"Women be shoppin'!"
Couldn't resist. [ROFL1]

[KevDen2005]

I would have to agree that no matter what the woman decides to do, she should discuss it with the man involved. Ultimately, she could do whatever she wants without consulting the man, but she should have the common courtesy to at least have the conversation with him. I've heard stories of a woman having an abortion because she thought the man she was with will be scared off because he doesn't want to have kids, to just find out later that he does. A couple I know was in that situation, and now that they are married and have two kids, she still regrets the decision she made back then.



With you on this

[n8tive97]

The laws are totally in the women's favor...
You get your girlfriend pregnant, she doesn't want the child, but you do... you lose.
You get your girlfriend pregnant, she wants the child and you don't, you get 18 years of child support...you lose.

I hate and will never understand abortion being a form of birth control! If you old enough to play your old enough to pay....

[Big Wall]

I am 100% for a woman's right to choose. I don't think abortion should be used as birth control, but it's not my decision to make. If a man doesn't want kids, there is a simple outpatient surgery to make sure that doesn't happen.

[Irving]

Sorry to hear man. Pretty much the same situation here, almost 5 years ago though.



Aren't you only like 17 years-old though?

[sniper7]

I don't think abortion should be illegal because in some cases such as rape or incest, the woman should not be forced into having the child no matter what the circumstance and she should have the choice at least.

But when you are old enough to make the decision to have sex, you are making the decision to be mature enough to be a parent. whether the two involved are mature enough to be good parents may be a question but even older people can be horrible parents.

Women say it is their "right" or their "choice". the guy should have just as much say as he had just as much of a part of the baby making process. it is a 2 way process and should be a 2 way street/decision.

We have our first due in October. It is amazing see how quickly they develop with the ultrasound pictures. I used to think more along the lines of the womens right to choose but after going through this process it makes me sad to think how many babies are actually aborted. I wish the women had to see what their child looks like and listen to the heartbeat before they have it ripped out of them.

[Sharpienads]

But when you are old enough to make the decision to have sex, you are making the decision to be mature enough to be a parent. whether the two involved are mature enough to be good parents may be a question but even older people can be horrible parents.

+1. If you make the decision to have sex, you make the decision to be a parent.

I don't know how anybody can get around abortion not being murder.

What really grinds my gears is I remember hearing during the Ft. Hood shooting (and I'm sure this happens all the time) one of those murdered was a pregnant woman. That should be two counts of murder right there. But it wasn't because if it was, than abortion would be murder, too.

[mcantar18c]

Aren't you only like 17 years-old though?
Yes I was 12 when it happened [ROFL1]
Where did you get the idea I was 17?


What really grinds my gears is I remember hearing during the Ft. Hood shooting (and I'm sure this happens all the time) one of those murdered was a pregnant woman. That should be two counts of murder right there. But it wasn't because if it was, than abortion would be murder, too.
+100

[Mobat555]

If a man doesn't want kids, there is a simple outpatient surgery to make sure that doesn't happen.

I am with Big Wall, either dont have sex or get fixed. If you want kids one day put some of your baby batter in the freezer.


While true, it takes two to make a baby, and the man should get a say. Maybe not 50/50 but at least 45/65.

My suggestion would be the man gets a say if the life is to be terminated. My wife got pregnant, took all responsibility he prodded her to abort and she refused (he choose to never met the baby and she never asked for any help from him of any kind). Now that baby is my little girl and count myself lucky that my wife had such a staunch moral code. If the rights were 50/50 then he could possibly take legal action against her if she choose to keep the child.

45+65=... lol

[Ronin13]

My suggestion would be the man gets a say if the life is to be terminated. My wife got pregnant, took all responsibility he prodded her to abort and she refused (he choose to never met the baby and she never asked for any help from him of any kind). Now that baby is my little girl and count myself lucky that my wife had such a staunch moral code. If the rights were 50/50 then he could possibly take legal action against her if she choose to keep the child.

45+65=... lol

Oops- I fudged that one! Why did it take so long for someone to catch my typo?

I agree that maybe instead of making abortion illegal, you make it so that when a woman goes into the clinic to have the procedure done there needs to be 2 signatures on the consent form- her's and the father's, as much as can be determined. But in many cases I see that as impossible. Still, I would be mighty pissed if I didn't get a word in the decision.

[Mobat555]

Still, I would be mighty pissed if I didn't get a word in the decision.

Choose your partners wisely, its truly your only defense.

[stevelkinevil]

As a single father of 2 boys this disgusts me and always has. Those boys are the best thing that ever happened to me, and the idea that if their mother wanted she could have just killed them with me having no say so (she would never had done that) is unbelievable. A child is every bit as much the mans as a woman's. If she doesnt want the responsibility, so be it, the father should have every opportunity to raise his child. Best overwhelming responsibility I ever took on.

[Ronin13]

As a single father of 2 boys this disgusts me and always has. Those boys are the best thing that ever happened to me, and the idea that if their mother wanted she could have just killed them with me having no say so (she would never had done that) is unbelievable. A child is every bit as much the mans as a woman's. If she doesnt want the responsibility, so be it, the father should have every opportunity to raise his child. Best overwhelming responsibility I ever took on.

And what really makes me heated about the issue- 99% of the time courts side with the mother, even if she's a drug addicted, prostitute and the father is a damn good man... I've seen it happen with some people I know and it's just sad. How should women have more of a right to children than men? Ok great, they carry for 9 mos, we don't have any fucking control over that aspect of life, so why should men be minimized in the equation? My parents got divorced when my brother and I were young, my dad moved out, that's the only reason we stayed with mom was because we wanted to live in the house not a condo- if mom moved out it would have been the exact same, we stay at the house with our individual bed rooms, not shared room. Either way, people assumed it was because the court sided with mom on custody- no it was equal custody, we would switch off weekends and a few weekdays. It's a man's world, but when it comes to kids, women have the advantage.

[stevelkinevil]

And what really makes me heated about the issue- 99% of the time courts side with the mother, even if she's a drug addicted, prostitute and the father is a damn good man... I've seen it happen with some people I know and it's just sad. How should women have more of a right to children than men? Ok great, they carry for 9 mos, we don't have any fucking control over that aspect of life, so why should men be minimized in the equation? My parents got divorced when my brother and I were young, my dad moved out, that's the only reason we stayed with mom was because we wanted to live in the house not a condo- if mom moved out it would have been the exact same, we stay at the house with our individual bed rooms, not shared room. Either way, people assumed it was because the court sided with mom on custody- no it was equal custody, we would switch off weekends and a few weekdays. It's a man's world, but when it comes to kids, women have the advantage.

So true. Really the only reason I have my boys is because their mother is a good enough woman to realize that dad was more stable and would do a better job, she would have won in court and we both knew it, not because they would be better off with her but simply because of her gender. She is in the Navy now and see's them as often as she can, and we remain good friends. I will always love and respect her for not taking the boys and using them as a pawn as so many mothers I know do (including my own). Hell I dont even make her pay child support, just chip in on things like sports and school clothes ect. My boys are not a money maker or a way to garner sympathy, they are my most solemn responsibility and its my honor to be their father. I am just lucky I choose wisely (and got a little lucky) when I fathered children with her.

[hollohas]

I am 100% for a woman's right to choose. I don't think abortion should be used as birth control, but it's not my decision to make. If a man doesn't want kids, there is a simple outpatient surgery to make sure that doesn't happen.

And if a woman doesn't want kids? That's what we're talking about here...what if the woman doesn't want kids...

There are many sure fire ways that she can prevent getting pregnant too. Abortion is not one of them... And it's not solely up to the man to make sure she doesn't get pregnant. She has equal responsibility for birth control.

[Ronin13]

And if a woman doesn't want kids? That's what we're talking about here...what if the woman doesn't want kids...

There are many sure fire ways that she can prevent getting pregnant too. Abortion is not one of them... And it's not solely up to the man to make sure she doesn't get pregnant. She has equal responsibility for birth control.

THIS!
But the thing I hate the most, when they do get pregnant- this was an actual conversation my friend had with his at the time girlfriend:
M: "You're pregnant? What do you suppose we do, raise it ourselves? I wouldn't mind being a father."
W: Abortion
M: No, that's murder, if you don't want the kid we can give it up for adoption.
W: Yeah, but then I still have to carry the thing for 9 mos.
M: Millions are doing it every day, small sacrifice to avoid being a fucking murderer.
W: I am not in a good place in life right now to have a kid, nor be pregnant.
M: Fine, kill my child, you're the one that insisted we do it without a condom... bitch.

And thus I conclude that women will always fall back on the excuse that they have to carry for 9 mos... pretty flimsy- don't wanna have a kid then get your tubes tied.