The unique thing about Boulder is the bet high gun ownership rate coupled with a population that can absolutely afford to sue the city. Hopefully it works out that way.
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The unique thing about Boulder is the bet high gun ownership rate coupled with a population that can absolutely afford to sue the city. Hopefully it works out that way.
Who knows.. One of their board members lives here so they definitely know about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by wyome
I hope so as well. Easily 80% of the people I have ever met living in Boulder the last 18 years has a gun of some sort. Many of those have the types of guns that are banned with this ordnance. The council went out of their way to ignore the populace and their statements indicate that as well. I believe that once again last night there were 9 people that spoke on the ban 7 of them being against it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving
I believe there are still changes that are going to be made to this. The council voted to pass an ordinance that still needed to be amended so basically no one really knows what is all going to be included.Quote:
Originally Posted by boxy
How can you pass something that is not in its final form?
Pure bullshit.
Oh, wait - you have to pass it to see what's in it.
It doesn't matter what the majority say about it. it's all about feels and making sure like other City Council ordinances, makes a political statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by def90
Planned Parenthood donates more money to political causes than the NRA. The NRA is membership sponsored, PP, they get money from the .gov. Who gets it from You the Taxpayer.
Reading through the text of the third reading seems like it is very similar to Denver's laws. Looks like pistols can have 15 or fewer rounds, but centerfire can have only have 10 or less. Other exceptions for tube and rimfire. I am no lawyer though so just my interpretation.
It is a little confusing though, can a non-Boulder resident drive through Boulder with an AR in their car and in a case without any issues, or is that now illegal?
Part e, Does this mean any weapon?Quote:
5-8-10. – Possession and Sale of Illegal Weapons.
(a) No person shall knowingly possess or sell or otherwise transfer an illegal weapon.
(b) The defendant's knowledge that the weapon was illegal is not an aspect of knowledge
required for violation of this section.
(c) Nothing in this section shall be construed to forbid any person:
(1) Holding a Federal Firearms License issued by the United States Government
from possession of any firearm authorized pursuant to such license;
(2) From possessing a weapon for which the United States Government has issued
a stamp or permit pursuant to the National Firearms Act;
(3) From possessing a handgun magazine so long as the possession of the handgun
and magazine are in compliance with state law; or
(4) Selling an illegal weapon to a person identified in Section 5-8-25, “Exemptions
from this Chapter,” B.R.C. 1981.
(d) Nothing in this section shall be deemed to apply to any firearm that has been modified
either to render it permanently inoperable or to permanently make it not an assault
weapon.
(e) Nothing in this section shall be deemed to restrict a person's ability to travel with a
weapon in a private automobile or other private means of conveyance for hunting or
for lawful protection of a person's or another's person or property while traveling into,
though, or within, the City of Boulder, regardless of the number of times the person
stops in the City of Boulder.
The laws only apply to Boulder residents so feel free to drive here and shoot up a bunch of people, it's all good as long as someone from Boulder doesn't do it.Quote:
Originally Posted by johngraves2
I guess those in Boulder can throw on the thorsden stock and make their ASSAULT rifles non-scary and unable to shoot thirty caliber magazine clips in half a second.Quote:
Originally Posted by def90
On another note, did the 21 age limit to possess any firearm pass as well? Any grandfathering?
I’m assuming the 21 age limit is still there. Grandfathering via certificate. No exceptions for anyone but law enforcement and military while on duty and federal concealed carry permits. Though I would assume that if it came down to it you could get a copy of you 4473 to prove you owned something down the road.. I’m not complying and I don’t know anyone else that is going to either. At least cops are bound by this law on their personal firearms. No exceptions for FFL holders either so theoretically the couple local gunshots would not be able to possess any of these firearms either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Will1776
I haven’t heard of any filed lawsuits yet but there has to be a few lawyers out there licking their lips.
Good. People in Boulder need to stand up to this tyranny before it gets worseQuote:
Originally Posted by def90
Spend some time in GSC and you will see some interesting characters. What's the membership of the Boulder Gun Club? How many are on the waiting list?Quote:
Originally Posted by def90
The 21 year old age limit in the ordnance is amusingly absurd, as it states you can't possess a firearm, EXCEPT in your home/private property, in your car, while engaged in lawful shooting activities, etc. Pretty much everything normal non-criminal thing you do with a gun at age 18-21 is covered, including home defense.
From the BRC President this evening...Quote:
Originally Posted by def90
Quote:
The Boulder Rifle Club, along with others, is filing suit against the city et al. We assert that by their actions they have infringed on not only the 2nd, but also the 5th and 14th Amendments to the United States Constitution and violated other federal and state laws.
(c) Nothing in this section shall be construed to forbid any person:Quote:
Originally Posted by def90
(1) Holding a Federal Firearms License issued by the United States Government
from possession of any firearm authorized pursuant to such license;
Which version is that from? I was at the second reading and they removed FFL exemption.Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus13
That's the way it is written in the third reading on that link you posted before. The text starts on like 230 or something in that PDF.Quote:
Originally Posted by def90
Based on comments by council members I have read they plan on passing more amendments to it going forward cause they know it is not well written and is confusing. That should be illegal regardless of the topic. Pass something that is bad just to pass something and then come back later and change it???
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http://www.dailycamera.com/news/ci_3...-sue-city-over
Lawsuit filed. It's on, boys and girls.
https://bit.ly/2IqojCo
Quote:
A Colorado city has passed a ban on the sale and possession of so-called “assault weapons,” despite protests in recent weeks by gun rights advocates, KUSA-TV reported.
The Boulder City Council unanimously voted for the ordinance, which will go into effect June 15. Still, some council members expressed concerns over the measure.
“I don’t agree with this ordinance in many ways,” Councilwoman Mirabai Nagle said during Tuesday night’s meeting, according to the Daily Camera. “It’s not perfect; I think we’re going to spend a lot of time and money.”
The ban will make it illegal to possess, sell or otherwise transfer “semiautomatic firearms designed with military features to allow rapid spray firing for the quick and efficient killing of humans” after June 15.
About the Ban
People who legally possessed assault weapons before June 15 have four options:
- Remove the assault weapon or large capacity magazine from the city of Boulder;
- Render the assault weapon permanently inoperable;
- Surrender the assault weapon or large-capacity magazine to the Boulder Police Department for destruction; or
- If eligible, obtain a certificate for the assault weapon as provided in subsection (c).
“Subsection (c)” provides an avenue for legal owners of assault weapons before June 15 to get a certification from local law enforcement by submitting to a background check, securely storing the weapon, and only possessing it on their own property, on the premises of a gunsmith, or on a licensed firing range, or while traveling to or from one of those locations.
What Now?
With the passage of the overall ban, the council is likely to consider future amendments down the road, such as raising the minimum age for firearm purchases to 21 from 18.
The Mountain States Legal Foundation has announced its intention to challenge the ban in court, saying it violates the Second, Fifth and 14th Amendments, as well as the Colorado Constitution.
Still, some in Boulder are celebrating the ban as a potential sign of things to come.
“My hope is that we will see more bans at the state level and one day at the federal level so these weapons will no longer be available,” Councilman Aaron Brockett said.
submit to a background check AGAIN after they already went through one to buy the rifle in the first place? [emoji19]
Subsection - get a certificate? why? so the city knows you have it? This violates the Colorodo Constitution clause on gun registries which are banned/illegal.
What keeps someone from saying they moved and listing a different address on their ATF Form and buying one anyways?
You could use your parents address, grandparents address, a secondary address, a vacation home in the mountains, a business address in another city.
Is CBI gonna deny all Boulder City BG Check applications that list a Boulder address?
The day these rifles are banned nationally is the day ALL gun owners go lib hunting.
I'm so appalled at the blatant stupidity displayed by the Boulder City Council.
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Maybe it's that other pesky damn .gov issued document, the Driver's License, that has to match the address on the 4473?Quote:
Originally Posted by CoGirl303
you're not required by Colorado law to go get a new DL card with your new addres when you get a new address. Just have to go online and put in a change of address and write it on the back of the card. Still easy to change it, buy the rifle and then change it back later.Quote:
Originally Posted by crays
What about college students at Boulder who have addresses out of the city?
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Interesting, I guess the FFL's that required supporting documentation (in my case car registration), were just effing with me....Quote:
Originally Posted by CoGirl303
Many places won't take the address just written on the back.
I don't understand how a local law can control what you do elsewhere.
So in order to skirt one law (Boulder), you break another law (current address). This cascades into a rank violation of state law, which you won't get out of in court, in order to fight a law which is probably very fightable in court (assuming the prosecutor isn't Peruvian, since they love to eat guinea pigs).
The DL *does* have to reflect your current address to do the 4473. Alternatively, you can use your old DL w/ old address, so long as you provide another form of state-issued ID with current address such as: hunting license, fishing license, etc.
You also cannot shoot one on public land.Quote:
“Subsection (c)” provides an avenue for legal owners of assault weapons before June 15 to get a certification from local law enforcement by submitting to a background check, securely storing the weapon, and only possessing it on their own property, on the premises of a gunsmith, or on a licensed firing range, or while traveling to or from one of those locations.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurley842002
A FFL will take (depending on who you use) a DL with COA on back. PROVIDING you show a current utility bill for new address.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving
05/15/18 Boulder City Council Meeting Packet pp 230-231, 11. Certification System:Quote:
Originally Posted by CoGirl303
"The police will not maintain any records of the certificates and will not replace lost certificates."
so they claim. [emoji849]Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus13
I trust a liberal about as far as I can pick one up and throw them.
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You're right it won't get you out of trouble in court.Quote:
Originally Posted by CavSct1983
By law it "should"...but how many people innocently get caught up in moving, get busy with packing/unpacking and turning on utilities, arranging their place, getting settled in and legitimately forget to change their address on their DL?
How many people in the Denver area do something similar to avoid emissions testing on their cars?
Bet it happens more than we'd like to think.
But I have two points in regards to why I posted what I did...
1.) This garbage town legislation criminalizes law abiding citizens.
2.) This piece of crap legislation will not stop anyone in Boulder from buying, selling or transferring the weapons it targets.
If the citizens of Boulder want to get around it...they can. That's all I'm saying.
Not debating if it is right, wrong, legal or illegal.
Most gun owners simply aren't going to comply with this at all and not that I blame them either.
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Ok, let's say you moved and you legitimately forgot to change your address online or update your DL by getting a new card because it slipped your mind and you didn't really think about it when you went to the FFL dealer and bought a gun?Quote:
Originally Posted by hurley842002
How do they know? Why would they request any documentation if they don't know and you didn't tell them?
That's the point I'm trying to make. Unless YOU the buyer tell the FFL dealer, no one is going to know! So it's easy for any citizen of Boulder to do the same and circumvent the system.
Especially if you have a second home or a business address in another city or you have family there.
Or maybe people come up with "Boulder is just our second home or getaway/vacation home".
Or you have a college student that has a permanent address at his/her parents house in another city but a temporary address in Boulder at an apt, renting a room at a house or a dorm. They don't update the addresses on their DL's. Mom and Dad just put their mail in a big envelope or a small box and send it to them or bring it by when they visit.
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I'm trying to understand the point... to show how badly thought out the leftist new law is? Like we need to look hard for that?
Their motivation? I think that one's pretty easy to figure out... just tell them that their new masters will abandon them now that they've done what the left wanted. Then show them that's the case by voting them out of office. Then ask them to tell THAT story... about how the left will use you and throw you away.
Do FFLs currently prevent residents of Denver from purchasing assault weapons?
Or follow Colorado law?
Do they even have to enforce city laws and ordinances that they are not located in?
Not advocating breaking the law. Just curious how this and other city laws apply to their citizens when outside imaginary bounderies.
Denver ban is similar to Boulder's older one. A semi auto only becomes a scary assault rifle when a mag over 15 rounds (used to be 20) is insertedQuote:
Originally Posted by Eric P
From Kevin Lundberg
Quote:
Boulder Gun Law
The People's Republic of Boulder has proven, once again, that their respect for the laws of the State of Colorado is slim to non-existent. Their banning what they call "assault weapons" is a direct violation of what was once called SB03-25, and is now called CRS 29-11.7-103:
"A local government may not enact an ordinance, regulation, or other law that prohibits the sale, purchase, or possession of a firearm that a person may lawfully sell, purchase, of possess under state or federal law."
This law is extremely clear, no local government can override state law when it comes to gun control regulations. Their argument that a home-rule city is exempt from this law is also without legal merit, as CRS 29-11.7-101 (2) (a) declares that the "...regulation of firearms is a matter of statewide concern..." and, in CRS 29-11.7-101 (1) (f) it includes in it's list of local governments a "city and county," which at the time of this legislation meant the home-rule jurisdiction called Denver. Home-rule jurisdictions are specifically mentioned because it applies to home-rule jurisdictions.
Finally, I was in the legislature when this bill passed, I voted for the bill, I was a co-sponsor of the bill, I know we passed SB03-25 precisely because we knew there would be a time when a city like Boulder would seek to defy state laws concerning the use and possession of firearms.
If the people of Boulder want to ban "assault weapons" they need to seek the legal path, through the legislature. As it is, the city of Boulder has become the law breaker.
Loosen thine sphincter Boulder, City of.
You will be loved tenderly
Wondering this too. My DL says Boulder but I don't live in the city. I'm guessing Westminster Arms or 5280 wouldn't care. Will CBI deny a 4473 if I want to pick up another lower receiver?Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric P
I wanna know does CBI reject an application for the buyer of an AR-15 if a buyer is from Denver city or Denver County?Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric P
What if you are a Denver city/county resident and go outside the city limit and buy? Does the FFL and/or CBI reject the app?
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Denver does not ban AR15s. And I believe CBI only knows your name at the time of the background check.Quote:
Originally Posted by CoGirl303
CBI only knows that it is a long gun, the type or model is not submitted.Quote:
Originally Posted by CoGirl303
Same.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtneer