nope, too busy typing... the two finger point-n-poke methodQuote:
Originally Posted by bogie
nope, too busy typing... the two finger point-n-poke methodQuote:
Originally Posted by bogie
Any place a democrat is at, justifying their stand against guns
From what I gathered, people knew him. That's all I meant by the friendly thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoneyBadger
I donno all the details. You know more than I do. But I guess I'm wrong.
Either way, my statement stands. No armed non-LE in a station or jail.
FWIW: "Friendly Fire" generally refers to an accidental shooting of friendly forces. Trust me... the hours of lectures, training, and CBTs (Computer-Based Training) we had after this asshat shot up Ft Hood was grueling.Quote:
Originally Posted by JM Ver. 2.0
I'm not arguing this at all. In this case, you know better than I do. I've never been in a police station or jail.Quote:
Originally Posted by JM Ver. 2.0
Did you ever get the second set of patches I sent you? [Beer]
For anyone worried about handguns on planes and how dangerous they are, take a look at some videos of the damage a WWII fighter or bomber could absorb and still keep flying. And we're not talking handgun rounds...more like 20mm, artillery flak and really big, incendiary shit. And that was 40s technology.
Personally, I'm not worried about guns on planes. Some of you guys make it sound like an otherwise rational, law-abiding person is gonna go apeshit and shoot the plane outta the sky just because he/she is allowed to carry on a plane.
Exactly. Just from what I heard was the guy was known to the people he shot. That's all I meant.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoneyBadger
That is not it at all. It is the captivity of the plane, kind of hard to evade on a plane. That reduces my defensive capacities. No cover except other bodies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bailey Guns
You won't need to find cover... Just pee on yourself and the threat will go away! [facepalm]Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkCO
Some people refer to this as "Shooting in the sea of heads." The next time you are sitting in a high number seat looking forward, while everyone is seated, you will see what I'm talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkCO
Fortunately, it doesn't happen very often [Flower]
I only worry about snakes on a plane.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bailey Guns
The reality is though, commercial airliners are not going to be brought down by a bullet hole in the fuselage. It will probably screw up cabin pressure and make things bumpy, but the Hollywood explosive decompression really doesn't happen in aircraft unless they had more than a couple other structural issues going on.
I understand, but even then... Devise a program similar to CLEAR or whatever it's called. Pre-screen properly licensed people who can carry. They're not likely to freak out and start shooting up the plane any more than an armed pilot is. And if the pilot freaks out there's little you can do anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkCO
Um, planes back then were not pressurized and they rarely flew above levels that required oxygen until they were over their target area to try to get above the flak.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bailey Guns
True shooting a hole even in a pressurized plane is not going to cause catastrophic damage but it would definitely cause a lack of oxygen and the bullet could very well hit wires, hydraulics or spark an explosion in an empty fuel cell. Based on the regular reports of people freaking out on planes while in mid flight I will forego the right to carry a firearm on a plane at this time.
You may choose to forego that right, however, there is a laundry list of special people who are allowed to carry on board. If it was really that dangerous, I would think that list would be either be much smaller or completely done away with altogether.Quote:
Originally Posted by def90
Given the type of searches conducted on people going into lockup facilities, I am more confident that they are not armed then I am with the possibility that passengers on the airplane are not armed.
Space
^ WINNER!! [ROFL1]Quote:
Originally Posted by earplug
I would not carry it there ,even someone pay me to carry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by earplug
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPrena
I posted this because our church has a sign with severe peanut allergy sign at a building, and one of the elder was eating peanut as a snack..... hahaQuote:
Originally Posted by cstone
hahahaha Winner!Quote:
Originally Posted by earplug
New York & California for starters...
Not where is it illegal, but where should it be illegal.Quote:
Originally Posted by BushMasterBoy
Besides, lots of people carry in both those states. Why should it be illegal for any law abiding citizen to carry there? If the police can justify the need to be armed, that same justification can be used to defend the rights of citizens to be armed.
So far I'm still only willing to be disarmed in the place where the inmates get stripped searched. I will abide by the will of private property owners, and leave if they ask me to do so. I didn't mention public pools or outer space as both seem either obvious or unlikely. Clearly international travel adds another layer of complications, and is beyond the scope of my initial question. I'm not convinced on any of the other locations mentioned. If you have the clearance to be in a high security area, you should be trustworthy with a firearm. IMO, cell phones with cameras and USB drives cause more damage to national security than a few handguns.
Fixed[Abused]Quote:
Originally Posted by SA Friday
Capt. Malcolm Reynolds: Just get us on the ground!Quote:
Originally Posted by SA Friday
Hoban 'Wash' Washburn: That part'll happen pretty definitely.
I'll give you judges for sure. I would have no problem with them packing. Actually I think it's a great idea.Quote:
Originally Posted by cstone
I'm well aware of who and how many people carry guns on planes. It ain't that many.
I completely disagree with your comment on the average citizen. Especially at the airport. Go stand by a gate for half an hour and listen to the stupid shit people ask the gate agents. I can assure you that you will have less faith in humanity. Perhaps even feel a little dumber for having done it. It really is that bad.
I know common sense is a dirty word these days, being usurped by the liberals, but I do think it applies to guns on airplanes. Meaning that all ammo should be frangible, glaser-type stuff while on the plane. They could hand it out with the fucking peanuts. Can you imagine? Stewardess comes up and offers you a hot towel, whiskey soda, and some glasers. People all over the plane calmly changing out their mags, racking the slides. I doubt Ahab would have much success with a plane like that.
I'll weigh in... I think the only places where common folks like you and me should not be allowed to carry (I'm excepting OneGuy, Kev, and JM) are detention facilities (to include county jail, state prison, federal prison, etc), courts (same rules as current, metal detectors and deputies/cops), mental/drug treatment facilities, and commercial aircraft. On the airplane thing- this is not for "safety" in terms of stray rounds causing depressurization, as has been said, that's not really a catastrophic/crash incident, I'm more worried about: small space + lots of innocents + armed citizen who is potentially not even remotely trained in CQB = BAD! I'm cool with being on a plane with an armed person, I'm not cool with the fact that one miss is probably going to end the life of an innocent.
I not so worried about the LEO on my plane than the idiot who gets drunk and fights with the guy next to him. It happens a hell of a lot more often than people think. I'd rather not enter a firearm into that equation....and it would happen. People seem to loose their g-damn minds on airplanes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin13
Anyone genuinely afraid of people packing guns on airplanes need to stop learning physics from Hollywood movies.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fi1_1l7M8FA
The only downside to law abiding citizens CCWing on airplanes is that Jihidists will die without getting their 72 virgins and TSA will be virtually unnecessary (they can go back to being "Skycaps" and fetch our luggage like the good ole days).
That was an awesome episode... Hence another reason (despite being good friends with an aeronautical engineer who explained the decompression myth years before the Mythbusters episode) I don't fear a stray round bringing the plane down. I just thought of another place no one should ever carry a firearm- The Internet! That place is full of wild emotions and some pretty loony assholes (mostly in and around that scary part of YouTube and all over Infowars.com)... [Coffee]Quote:
Originally Posted by Zundfolge
I am seeing that someone didn't do really well in 8th grade physics.Quote:
Originally Posted by mtnhack
I can pretty much guarantee that I didn't learn physics from Hollywood movies. Nor am I afraid of an airplane blowing up if a shot is fired. I am however afraid of someone who is not trained in the retention of a weapon bringing one aboard my jet. And again....your average Joe carrying a firearm onto an airplane is beyond stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zundfolge
unfortunatley the liberals use the same logic. "im not so worried about the LEO (who may have no clue and are still human) who comes to my restaurant, ball game, theater, etc, its the idiot who gets drunk and then kills everyone with his deranged mind and killer gun. and the blood has run in the streets just like the liberals said it would, if concealed carry got approved in more places.Quote:
Originally Posted by RMAC757
LEO's are trained in weapon retention. Most CCW carriers are not. And there is certainly no standard for CCW carriers to be held to as far as retention goes. This is not a Liberal/Conservative thing. When some dad or mom is full on destroying a bag of peanuts, slugging cokes and yelling at their kids on the way to Orlando. It would be easy for Johnny Jihad or anyone else to relieve them of their firearm. I've seen more than a few who were "allowed" make me cringe as I saw how they were printing. It's never gonna happen. And I don't know anybody in my business who wants it to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HBARleatherneck
the airplane arguement is really stupid anyway. I think we all believe a private company can make the rule against carrying. and Im sure all the airlines would ban carry. now, if they get any government funds. forget it. not that the taxpayers should be paying for any of this crap. be competitive or close shop.
So, let me get this straight....
Because there are folks to protect you on an airplane your OK with giving up your right to defend yourself?
Huh....
I guess then since there are standing armed forces and police to defend us we should all lay down our weapons and trust that no matter what the armed folks around us will protect us??
Interesting,
So try this one on for size-
You know why you dont read about a nutjob driving up to a gun range, pulling out his pistol, and proceeding to fire off some rounds? Because there are folks with guns there.
Armed folks, or even the possibility of armed folks, tend to keep the noise down. None of these whackjobs out there sought out any areas where there possibly would be armed resistance.
Now, airplanes are confined, give yout hat. But the always have been. And AGAIN, for DECADES, as in MORE THAN ONE, folks thought nothing of carrying thier firearms onto the plane. Never heard tell of someone going crazy and shooting one up. Never heard of one hijacked, never heard of one bombed out of the sky. Even in wartime.
Now, pnder this...
A guy gets agitated on the plane, he knows that no one has any sort of weapon on the plane, so there are no consequences to any of his actions beyond possible arrest. Now, lets say that the possibility exists that in a cabin of 125 people 30 of them are carrying weapons of one sort or the other. Changes things a bit. Now if he shows his ass there is a real possibility he will be looking down the barrel of a citizen with a loaded weapon and pissed because you disturbed his in flight movie.
Just how much training in retention do I need when you can't see my weapon and it's snugged under my armpit or down by ... well, anyone reaching in there WILL be noticed and WILL get an elbow in the face (unless she looks really good in a bikini). I really don't want to be on alert all the time, would rather sleep on most of my plane trips so am hardly likely to want to carry even if it's allowed but "retention" is one of the dumbest arguments I've seen against it.Quote:
Originally Posted by RMAC757
The last time I checked, most of us weren't asking to relax background check or training rules to get a CHP so anyone who WOULD carry concealed on an plane is already part of one of the most law-abiding demographic groups in the nation.
As far as the question goes, I can see barring private concealed carry at places where emotions have a tendency to run high (e.g., courthouses) or people have often wanted to make a political statement (e.g., White House or Capitol building) but I would generally prefer they allowed carry by licensed individuals subject to security check.
Umm, you guys forgot Colorado in general.... [gohome]
Second that.Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkCO
How about:
No person is allowed to carry when on a security detail or part thereof for any government official who has supported, voted for, or sponsored any anti-2A bill, order or activity in any way or form.
Sounds good to me. Let them see just what it feels like to be forcibly disarmed.
Seconded!
Really....one of the dumbest arguments you've seen on this? Ask a law enforcement officer how much time they spend on weapon retention. All it would take is one careless person carrying and one motivated terrorist, psyco, whatever to seize the moment. Most passengers aren't quite as ninja as yourself. May I ask.....what do you do for a living?Quote:
Originally Posted by Aloha_Shooter
I am suddenly more interested in what you do for a living?Quote:
Originally Posted by RMAC757