Stolen valor act ruled unconstitutional

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07-16-2010, 16:04
scratchy

Stolen valor act ruled unconstitutional

So now it's just offensive and not illegal to be an asshat.

Linky: http://www.9news.com/news/article.as...3981&catid=339

DENVER http://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adT...lass_10x10.gif - A federal judge dismissed the criminal case against admitted veteran imposter Rick Strandlof, also known as Rick Duncan, and said the law that prohibits lying about military honors is unconstitutional.
The decision, issued Friday morning by US District Court Judge Robert Blackburn, ends the prosecution of Strandlof, who admitted to 9Wants to Know Investigator Jace Larson that he lied about receiving military decorations.
07-16-2010, 16:16
HBARleatherneck

fuck him. even if they ruled it unconstitional, he needs a very bad ass kicking every day from now on. he needs the pain to be fresh in his mind everyday, so he understands the difference between saying you are something like a cop or fireman, and a real hero.
07-16-2010, 16:25
High Altitude

So does this mean anybody can imposter a veteran?????

WTF???
07-16-2010, 16:54
Not_A_Llama

Quote:

Originally Posted by High Altitude

So does this mean anybody can imposter a veteran?????

WTF???

I'm pretty sure "impostor" isn't a verb.
07-16-2010, 17:07
CrufflerSteve

There was a blurb about it at a legal, fairly conservative site:
http://volokh.com/2010/07/16/stolen-...onstitutional/

The comments below get to the point. If this was upheld all sorts of false statements might become illegal. OMFG! All the politicians and lawyers would be convicted!

Steve
07-16-2010, 17:07
Elhuero

Quote:

Originally Posted by Not_A_Llama

I'm pretty sure "impostor" isn't a verb.

douche, however can be a noun and a verb

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v9...macht-frei.jpg
07-16-2010, 17:15
Ridge

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrufflerSteve

All the politicians and lawyers would be convicted!

Steve

So was there a negative side to it?
07-16-2010, 17:19
CrufflerSteve

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ridge

So was there a negative side to it?

To me it's all positive. Of course I'm not a judge, just an engineer. Judges are lawyers. It's why sharks don't eat lawyers: "professional courtesy".

Steve
07-16-2010, 17:28
HBARleatherneck

so, if it is not illegal to pretend and identify yourself as a Veteran.

then, I am getting a new pOlice badge. and i am going to tell everyone i am a police officer. Protected Speech under the first ammendment.

seriously though, now that this has been shot down, how long before an attorney uses this in a criminal impesonation case?

now we dont have to get ccw badges. we can just get police officer badges.
07-16-2010, 17:38
Not_A_Llama

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elhuero

douche, however can be a noun and a verb

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v9...macht-frei.jpg

I could goose step all day under that banner.
07-16-2010, 18:25
jerrymrc

Being a vet while I do not agree with the ruling I do understand where it came from. That said they need to compose the law so it does not interfere with ones 1st amendment rights.
07-16-2010, 19:05
Irving

If this had passed, would people still be aloud to make war movies and cop movies?
07-16-2010, 19:26
mutt

The govt can lie to its citizens, as in the case of police interrogating a suspect, so it makes sense that a citizen can lie as well and be protected. This guy may be a vile piece of shit, but he has that right.
07-16-2010, 19:33
SNAFU

Why worry? CRAP we got an imposter c-n-c,a few communisttype senators.......
07-16-2010, 19:44
theGinsue

Quote:

Originally Posted by HBARleatherneck

he needs a very bad ass kicking every day from now on. he needs the pain to be fresh in his mind everyday, so he understands the difference between saying you are something like a cop or fireman, and a real hero.

+1 I Soooo agree with that statement. I earned what I claim (not that I ever acturally talk about any of it) and I've got documentation to prove it.

For someone to falsely claim honors they never earned is FRAUD pure and simple.

Quote:

Originally Posted by High Altitude

So does this mean anybody can imposter a veteran?????

WTF???

Good question. Can an enlisted person wear an officers uniform and claim 1st amendment protection? Can a person claim to be a police officer and not be charged with impersonating a police officer?

I understand the potential implications of this ruling and what it would have meant had it not gone this way, but I do believe that certain protections against "stolen valor" should be in place.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mutt

The govt can lie to its citizens, as in the case of police interrogating a suspect, so it makes sense that a citizen can lie as well and be protected. This guy may be a vile piece of shit, but he has that right.

Something tells me that "making a false official statement" is still a convictable offense. I know that *I* won't be the one to test this.
07-16-2010, 19:57
mutt

Quote:

Originally Posted by theGinsue

Something tells me that "making a false official statement" is still a convictable offense. I know that *I* won't be the one to test this.

Making a false official statement and lying to a cop are two totally different things. You can lie to a cop all you want and it's not illegal. Cops can lie in order to get you to incriminate yourself and it's legal. In the end your best bet is say nothing to the police until you have a lawyer, but that's taking this thread way off course.
07-16-2010, 20:17
mitch

I forgot to mention I'm really Norman Schwarzkopf, Jr.

No, really I am. Seriously. I've got this here Desert Storm ribbon to prove it.

[Luck]
07-16-2010, 20:47
OneGuy67

I can only hope that the Attorney General's office will appeal it to the 10th Circuit. That court has been pretty reasonable in its determinations.
07-16-2010, 23:10
Byte Stryke

"Why Hell Son, I'm Better 'n Any veteran Out there. I fought in Every war since the battle of Concord!
Stormed the beach at Normandy by Myself!
See, lookat em ribbons!"
/joke

Now, I Can Honestly understand slight "embellishments" of Old men telling war stories.
But some of that shit pisses me right the Fuck off.
There are REAL Veterans begging for handouts on the streets and Homeless.
Then you have some Jackwagon actor goes to a Military surplus and winds up on the goddamned news eating at the capital or some fancy restaurant Getting Pampered and Bombarded with gifts by PR Hungry Politicians and the only shells he's seen had an oyster in them.

I'm no Gungho Rambo with any Silver stars or anything but I'll be fucked with a pudding-pop if I Sit around and let some jerkoff lie about shit that people I loved and served with died over.

/rant
[Rant2]

U.S. Army 1985-1992 Medical/Honorable
07-16-2010, 23:28
theGinsue

Well said. I especially loved this part:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byte Stryke

I'm no Gungho Rambo with any Silver stars or anything but I'll be fucked with a pudding-pop if I Sit around and let some jerkoff lie about shit that people I loved and served with died over.

/rant
[Rant2]

U.S. Army 1985-1992 Medical/Honorable

"f*ched with a pudding pop"? That's classic![ROFL1]
07-16-2010, 23:42
CrufflerSteve

I can sorta understand it if it doesn't set well with me. Might just have to be more blanket parties for creeps who steal honor they haven't earned.

That stuff about being okay to lie to cops might not be true. Martha Stewart went to prison for lying to a fed. Not even under oath. Crap. If they can lie to us why are they so frickin special.

Steve
07-17-2010, 09:33
mutt

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrufflerSteve

I can sorta understand it if it doesn't set well with me. Might just have to be more blanket parties for creeps who steal honor they haven't earned.

That stuff about being okay to lie to cops might not be true. Martha Stewart went to prison for lying to a fed. Not even under oath. Crap. If they can lie to us why are they so frickin special.

Steve

They got Martha for lying to federal investigators, among other things. A cop is not a federal investigator. And this ruling may even cast doubt on Title 18 of the U.S. Code Section 1001, the 'lying statute'. Of course they can always get you on obstruction of justice instead of lying.
07-17-2010, 12:27
OneGuy67

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byte Stryke;221912Now, I Can Honestly understand slight "embellishments" of Old men telling war stories.
But some of that shit pisses me right the Fuck off.
There are[B

REAL[/B] Veterans begging for handouts on the streets and Homeless.
Then you have some Jackwagon actor goes to a Military surplus and winds up on the goddamned news eating at the capital or some fancy restaurant Getting Pampered and Bombarded with gifts by PR Hungry Politicians and the only shells he's seen had an oyster in them.

I'm no Gungho Rambo with any Silver stars or anything but I'll be fucked with a pudding-pop if I Sit around and let some jerkoff lie about shit that people I loved and served with died over.

/rant
[Rant2]

U.S. Army 1985-1992 Medical/Honorable

I like you more and more Byte! I did like pudding pops until you gave me such a visual...I'll never be able to look at a pudding pop the same way again...[ROFL1]

U.S. Army Infantry 1985-1998, Military Police 2006-Current (Nat. Guard) (4 Honorable Discharges and counting; looking for one more along with my 20-year letter)
07-18-2010, 13:20
Irving

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart

If this had passed, would people still be aloud to make war movies and cop movies?

Anyone know?
07-18-2010, 19:58
mitch

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart

Anyone know?

You'll notice that in the movies, there is always something wrong with the uniform so they are "legal" per se.
07-19-2010, 01:01
Byte Stryke

Quote:

Originally Posted by mitch

You'll notice that in the movies, there is always something wrong with the uniform so they are "legal" per se.

It's been a long time ago and it is rather late, so nope, I do not remember the regulations by chapter and verse.
There are provisions withing the DoD regulations that allow wearing of a Military uniform for re-enactment, historical and entertainment purposes with DOD permission.

and no, that isn't why there is "always something wrong with them"
That's an old wives tale.
The truth is probably allot less glorious and technical than you might like.
Budget.
They are cranking out uniforms at a horrendous rate on a movie set for a few hundred extras and the Joe assigned to check em probably doesn't really care and most moviegoers don't notice anyways. Hurt Locker, Apocalypse now, Platoon, and dozens of others are examples.

Google saves the fuzzy Brain!
http://www.allmilitary.com/board/viewtopic.php?id=1501

Quote:

United States Code Title 10 > Subtitle A > Part II > Chapter 45

§ 772. When wearing by persons not on active duty authorized

(f) While portraying a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, an actor in a theatrical or motion-picture production may wear the uniform of that armed force if the portrayal does not tend to discredit that armed force.
07-19-2010, 07:36
GreenScoutII

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart

If this had passed, would people still be aloud to make war movies and cop movies?

Yeah, taken to it's illogical extreme as things often are in this country, it might have become an issue.....

Aside from movies, plays, and fictional stories, anyone wearing or claiming military honors he didn't earn is an asshat.

God bless our veterans....
07-19-2010, 12:57
Irving

Quote:

Originally Posted by mitch

You'll notice that in the movies, there is always something wrong with the uniform so they are "legal" per se.

That doesn't make sense because then you could leave out a little detail on a uniform and fool every day people and it'd be legal. Plus what everyone else said.
07-19-2010, 15:51
ronaldrwl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart

If this had passed, would people still be aloud to make war movies and cop movies?

I don't think acting in a movie would count as lying
07-19-2010, 17:36
theGinsue

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronaldrwl

I don't think acting in a movie would count as lying

Unless the actor was a politician!