subleasing to idiots. need some help

-Subleased my fiancees room to a boyfriend/girl friend. (they are not on the lease, its still under my fiancees name.)

-last weekend the girl friend was arrested for domestic violence for beating the bf up at the appartment [ROFL1]. she is still in jail.

-last night one of the roommates was sleeping around midnight and wakes up to the bf in her room on her bed staring at her. he stole some money from her wallet and i think was considering harming her or stealing more.

so obviously the two idiots will be forced to move out today by me.

legally we are allowed to toss them correct?

he is also a 5'4'' wanna be thug so i'm prepared for him to be a punk about it. i don't want to get into all that. would the local PD assist me if it hits that point due to the lease?

Based on my experience you have to go through the eviction process. Unless she wants to press charges. Your fiancee could get into a bit of a mess as well if the original lease had a no sublease clause in it which most do. If the police get involved as the owner may be notified.

Did you have them sign a lease? If not you can throw them out any time.

If you did have them sign a lease, unless you have a pretty well worded clause regarding crime on the property, then you be fucked and will have to go through the eviction process.

Though if you tell him to leave and he does he made the choice to do so...

I was also going to bring up the possibility of a no sublease clause causing you some trouble. My question is if there's any legal reason you can't toss their stuff out and say they're tresspassing. I know it's not really that simple but you know...something along those lines.

Is the girl even hot?

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Originally Posted by asmotao

Did you have them sign a lease? If not you can throw them out any time.

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NOPE [Shake] CRS 38-10-108


Here are the forms/information for evictions in Colorado. If I were you I would follow this stuff exactly.

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Originally Posted by DD977GM2

Is the girl even hot?

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And not like this!!!
http://i572.photobucket.com/albums/s...is/tequila.jpg
[LOL]

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Originally Posted by hobowh

Though if you tell him to leave and he does he made the choice to do so...

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that's how I would play it.. angle it like you are "letting" them out of the lease before you "have to get the cops involved, get the attys, and eviction etc"

and see what they do....

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Originally Posted by Waywardson174

NOPE [Shake] CRS 38-10-108

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I may be wrong (as is usually the case) but I was under the impression that CRS 38-10-108 only applied to the lease or sale of unimproved land.

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Originally Posted by asmotao

Did you have them sign a lease? If not you can throw them out any time.

If you did have them sign a lease, unless you have a pretty well worded clause regarding crime on the property, then you be fucked and will have to go through the eviction process.

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That is about as wrong as it possibly can be.

If you've allowed them to stay, even without a lease, you may have to formally evict them if they choose to fight it and know their rights under the law. Now, if you can "convince" them to leave voluntarily that's a different story.

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Originally Posted by cysoto

I may be wrong (as is usually the case) but I was under the impression that CRS 38-10-108 only applied to the lease or sale of unimproved land.

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There is no limitation I can see in the statute itself or any of the annotating case law. Leases of less than one year are the only specific exception made to the writing requirement.

Let me begin by saying that I AM NOT A LAWYER but it is my understanding that, any contract (verbal or written) would be binding in this situation. If the OP has no written agreement and no specified contract clauses, (baring both parties agreeing to part ways amicably) as it has already been mentioned, he will have to go through an eviction process.

38-12-510. Unlawful removal or exclusion
It shall be unlawful for a landlord to remove or exclude a tenant from a dwelling unit without resorting to court process, unless the removal or exclusion is consistent with the provisions of article 18.5 of title 25, C.R.S., and the rules promulgated by the state board of health for the cleanup of an illegal drug laboratory or is with the mutual consent of the landlord and tenant or unless the dwelling unit has been abandoned by the tenant as evidenced by the return of keys, the substantial removal of the tenant's personal property, notice by the tenant, or the extended absence of the tenant while rent remains unpaid, any of which would cause a reasonable person to believe the tenant had permanently surrendered possession of the dwelling unit. Such unlawful removal or exclusion includes the willful termination of utilities or the willful removal of doors, windows, or locks to the premises other than as required for repair or maintenance. If the landlord willfully and unlawfully removes the tenant from the premises or willfully and unlawfully causes the termination of heat, running water, hot water, electric, gas, or other essential services, the tenant may seek any remedy available under the law, including this part 5.

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Originally Posted by Waywardson174

There is no limitation I can see in the statute itself or any of the annotating case law. Leases of less than one year are the only specific exception made to the writing requirement.

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In that case, since the OP has no written contract, will he have to prove what agreement (if any) they had as to the length of the lease?

Edited to add:
I think I found the answer to my question on page 78 of the Ft. Collins Landlord-Tenant Handbook: (http://www.fcgov.com/neighborhoodser...lthandbook.pdf)

8. If the landlord and tenant do not have anything in writing, do they have any sort of lease? Colorado law requires any lease longer than a year to be in writing or else it is void. (C.R.S.38-10-108). Verbal arrangements for less than a year can be enforceable, but there can be problems proving the terms of the verbal agreement if a dispute does arise. If you clearly have a month-to-month verbal arrangement with no other understanding, the tenancy can be terminated with 10 days written notice prior to the end of the month. This is a vulnerable position for you to be in as a tenant. Some leases state that holdover past a specified term results in a month-to-month with other terms of the old lease still applying. If the lease does not state what happens upon holdover, the law imposes a new tenancy for the same length as the original lease. Different types of leases are further explained on page 4.

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Originally Posted by Fromk

I was also going to bring up the possibility of a no sublease clause causing you some trouble. My question is if there's any legal reason you can't toss their stuff out and say they're tresspassing. I know it's not really that simple but you know...something along those lines.

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I was thinking something along those line initially. leave or i will say your trespassing, but then i thought that renters have rights even if they are not under contract, so that may be an issue. although i highly doubt they have the IQ required to figure this stuff out.

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Originally Posted by DD977GM2

Is the girl even hot?

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hell no. shes a beast. she dwarfs him. and told him they were engaged after knowing eachother 6 months.

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Originally Posted by Waywardson174

NOPE [Shake] CRS 38-10-108


Here are the forms/information for evictions in Colorado. If I were you I would follow this stuff exactly.

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thanks!

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Originally Posted by Chad4000

that's how I would play it.. angle it like you are "letting" them out of the lease before you "have to get the cops involved, get the attys, and eviction etc"

and see what they do....

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i like this idea

Chemical warfare: Baked beans, pickled eggs, beef jerky, and malt liquor. Repeat as necessary.[Gas1]

are you down in TX like your location says or back here? TX might have a whole different set of laws and statutes.

I think down there, the barrel end of a shotgun is an eviction notice.[Tooth]

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Originally Posted by sniper7

TX might have a whole different set of laws and statutes.

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Good catch! I hadn't seen that. [Beer]

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Originally Posted by TFOGGER

Chemical warfare: Baked beans, pickled eggs, beef jerky, and malt liquor. Repeat as necessary.[Gas1]

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[ROFL1][ROFL2][ROFL3][ROFL3][ROFL2][ROFL1]

[There is no ROFLandcrying emoticon.]

So your room mate on the lease caught a non leese stealing and felt there was potential for assault on her person. GFB homie or we contact LE.

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Originally Posted by Bailey Guns

That is about as wrong as it possibly can be.

If you've allowed them to stay, even without a lease, you may have to formally evict them if they choose to fight it and know their rights under the law.

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Been there. Done that. Got the T-Shirt. Except in my case the guy brought home a stolen motorcycle.

He refused to leave and got lawyers involved. He couldn't prove any aspect of a supposed verbal contract. I won.

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Originally Posted by sniper7

are you down in TX like your location says or back here? TX might have a whole different set of laws and statutes.

I think down there, the barrel end of a shotgun is an eviction notice.[Tooth]

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fort collins

Texas life starts in a month [Coffee]

i think we have decided to tell him he has until saturday at noon to move out because they have been late on bills/rent and the recent issues with cops and theft they should be gracious I'm giving him that much time.

if he objects i will feed him some bs about he had a verbal contract with me, not the lessor, any living situation in colorado over 30 days must be in writing, and we let them by on the first few broken agreements, but now its too much. bye bye

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Originally Posted by asmotao

Been there. Done that. Got the T-Shirt. Except in my case the guy brought home a stolen motorcycle.

He refused to leave and got lawyers involved. He couldn't prove any aspect of a supposed verbal contract. I won.

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That's a lot different than just being able to "throw them out at any time".

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Originally Posted by asmotao

Did you have them sign a lease? If not you can throw them out any time.

If you did have them sign a lease, unless you have a pretty well worded clause regarding crime on the property, then you be fucked and will have to go through the eviction process.

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Wrong, I had Police/other sources all say inform me once someone has gone and lived under the roof for a week or more, they go and get protection of the eviction process. Basically why they discourage someone "crashing on the couch" for any period of time over a couple days.

Might want to press charges/file restraining to be safe based on the in room behavior, even if it doesn't stick it could be useful for immediate removal of the person?

3 S's....


Not really serious....

mostly.

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Originally Posted by aahorn

if he objects i will feed him some bs about he had a verbal contract with me, not the lessor, any living situation in colorado over 30 days must be in writing, and we let them by on the first few broken agreements, but now its too much. bye bye

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I've personally seed a meth-manufacturing IDIOT destroy a landlord represented by counsel because the landlord tried to pull an illegal (read: without proper procedure) over his eyes. The judge was livid with the landlord and the counsel sat there shaking his head while his client got steamrolled because he violated the law.

I wish you the best of luck either way, but playing outside the rules means you are no longer protected by them.


That said, keep us updated.

in fort collins there is also "U + 2 law" could i say we recieved complaints about how many occupants we have here so you gotta go?

Since you are in Fort Collins and not Texas try this one: C.R.S. 13-40-107.5 Termination of tenancy for substantial violation http://www.lexisnexis.com/hottopics/...S.+13-40-107.5

Basically you can evict them quicker for being violent. Read the part about not evicting the boyfriend as a victim of domestic violence, you can toss the offender easily. The victim, the theft may be grounds, or just wait the 10 days (A Notice to Quit) to get them both out at the same time.

(4) (a) A tenancy may be terminated at any time on the basis of a substantial violation. The termination shall be effective three days after service of written notice to quit.

(5) (a) In any action for possession under this section, the landlord has the burden of proving the occurrence of a substantial violation by a preponderance of the evidence.

(b) In any action for possession under this section, it shall be a defense that:

(II) The tenant did not know of, and could not reasonably have known of or prevented, the commission of a substantial violation by a guest or invitee but immediately notified a law enforcement officer of his or her knowledge of the substantial violation.

(c) (I) The landlord shall not have a basis for possession under this section if the tenant or lessee is the victim of domestic violence, as that term is defined in section 18-6-800.3, C.R.S., or of domestic abuse, as that term is defined in section 13-14-101 (2), which domestic violence or domestic abuse was the cause of or resulted in the alleged substantial violation and which domestic violence or domestic abuse has been documented pursuant to the provisions set forth in section 13-40-104 (4).

(II) Nothing in this paragraph (c) shall prevent the landlord from seeking possession against a tenant or lessee of the premises who perpetuated the violence or abuse that was the cause of or resulted in the alleged substantial violation.

You are on your own to determine if a "substantial violation" occurred. Good Luck.

Yes, to answer the basic question, you must evict your 2 housemates

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Originally Posted by foxtrot

Chargeable offenses doesn't get you out of civil obligations; indeed, you can't even really bring that up in most circumstances. That said, if he "believes" you it could work. Be mindful of giving someone the opportunity to record you however. Generally, if your going to do it, don't threaten it. Your advise indicates you don't have any actual experience w/ the judicial system.

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Alright. What would the police do if she called them up and said, "This man who I barely know who was staying here with his girlfriend who was just arrested the other day has been coming into my bedroom at night while I'm sleeping and I told him to leave me alone but he keeps doing it and says we can't make him leave and I'm so scared he's going to hurt me" what do you think the police would do? Would they remove him from the apartment or would they tell the girls they have to let him stay there? I'm genuinely curious about what might happen in that case.

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Originally Posted by Clint45

Alright. What would the police do if she called them up and said, "This man who I barely know who was staying here with his girlfriend who was just arrested the other day has been coming into my bedroom at night while I'm sleeping and I told him to leave me alone but he keeps doing it and says we can't make him leave and I'm so scared he's going to hurt me" what do you think the police would do? Would they remove him from the apartment or would they tell the girls they have to let him stay there? I'm genuinely curious about what might happen in that case.

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They'd tell you to get a restraining order or begin an eviction.

just change the locks when they're out and tell them to come pick up their shit.

its a bluff but a hell of alot cheaper than an eviction. my lawyer charges $350.


as a landlord we've had tenants ask us to three day notice them for unauthorized occupants so they could coax their couch surfers away.

if the management is cool they'll do it for you

so here is what happened.

apparently he snuck into the other roommate's room (the one not mentioned before) and jacked $800 cash and took everything from his room but a pipe and his gf's arrest records.

so i highly doubt the puss muffin ever shows his face again.[Bang]

needless to say im a bit pissed off. and i checked the jail records it looks like his big beefy gf was bailed out. what a surprise.

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Originally Posted by aahorn

so here is what happened.

apparently he snuck into the other roommate's room (the one not mentioned before) and jacked $800 cash and took everything from his room but a pipe and his gf's arrest records.

so i highly doubt the puss muffin ever shows his face again.[Bang]

needless to say im a bit pissed off. and i checked the jail records it looks like his big beefy gf was bailed out. what a surprise.

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Dude what a nightmare! I can't believe you got into the business of subleasing your pad. It wasn't to Wiora was it? [ROFL3] JK JK.