Diesel pickups are for chumps

[Jer]

That's definately #1... you could buy a 20 Year old Diesel and still have money left to buy thousands of gallons of fuel AND whatever trailer you want to tow with it for similar money.

#2 I've seen commercials where they talk about towing a travel trailer. With a 20-year old 3/4 ton Diesel, you also can- including nearly any gooseneck or fifth wheel, which is going to be a no-go with the Rivian's 55" bed

#3 speaking of the 55" bed, can you get 2 round hay bales, or 4 square bales on it? (I don't even think it could take the weight of 2400-3000#)

#4 How about contracting? You're going to be bending sheetrock if it's hanging over the tailgate... and forget about 12' lumber or ranch gates without a trailer...

#5 I could drive off with a Diesel truck now (already have 2). When is the 180kW version going to be available? Have They even published a price on it yet? Because you're going to need lots more "range" if you start using it like a 3/4 ton.

Stick with comparing it to F150s... most of those are not used like real trucks most of the time anyway (some never). Many could not do some things on this list either.

ETA: I'm comparing to my 20 year old 3/4 ton flat-bed Diesel, since I've never seen wulf's F250. I tried to avoid smart-ass answers like "buy a set of batteries without a loan"... but this is by no means an exhaustive list.

Just to make sure, you're comparing to one of those new Rivian trucks, right? I wouldn't buy a new $100k truck or car either but that's just me. The real interesting time is when we start to see a used market for these vehicles so that normal folk can afford them.

You're also comparing diesels now which is removed from the F250 conversation we were having. I will agree that an EV pick-up doesn't fit every need but this requires you to admit the same thing for a 1-ton diesel. Cherry picking a situation where it may outperform (we don't even know what is coming but shit I'm reading says this may not be the case) and act like everything else doesn't exist. I will never try to convince the world that an EV is perfect for everyone and every need but there are entirely too many people out there willing to state that not a single one can meat a single individual need of anyone which is disingenuous.

[Wulf202]

Having taken my truck to the salvage yard where they unload you with a giant magnet, I wonder what would happen to an EV.

Also a short bed sucks for towing 5th wheels no matter the drive train.

[stodg73]

I am a 'chump', I drive several diesels...

[00tec]

My biggest issue with EVs is the charging time. My vacation is typically 2100 miles round trip. The less time I have to spend sitting still, the better. I can get 400 miles of recharge in 10 minutes and be on my way.

[Jer]

68charger nailed it. My 20 year old diesels are cheap and easy to work on. Hell my 12 valve is emp resistant bone stock and runs off used motor oil. On road trips I do 12 hours with only stops for bathroom needs, I have auxiliary tanks when I need them. In bed campers?

I can post pictures of my 8' bed stacked even with the cab of drywall (90 sheets of 5/8, 5 of 1/2). Loads of heavy stuff to the dump... An 8 ft bed is far to useful to me. Also the load rating is 14k on the goose, which is less than it can actually handle. I've had a 16k backhoe on a 7500lb trailer.

I've seen duramax's do 32k over the mountains and 48k in the plains.

I love the idea of EMP resistant but be real here, if we get EMP we'll all have MUCH larger issues than if our pick em up truck starts or not. I get the thinking but after years of worrying about an EMP I'm not going to continue living my life in fear of something that will never happen.

You kind of touched on something regarding your road trips.. bathroom needs. People often want an EV to do 1,000 miles on a single charge which isn't realistic (with today's technology anyway) because we as humans have biological needs. A couple of posts ago I mentioned driving our new (to us) Tesla Model S off of the lot in Seattle and then 2,500 miles over the next five days to see various spots down the coast before ending up back here in Colorado. At no point were we wishing we could just keep driving and disappointed we "had" to stop to charge. We stopped every 2hrs on average and each stop was scheduled for 20 minutes give or take 5min. Some longer, some shorter. This isn't too different from the road trips we took in ICE cars.

Each time we would get out, stretch, get some water and/or snacks, use the restroom and maybe check out a nearby shop or something and then return to find our car was ready to go. Occasionally we'd stop at a Supercharger and it would be around lunch or dinner time and there would be a decently rated restaurant nearby so we'd plug in and go eat. After an hour when we returned the car would be topped off which meant we'd need to stop less frequently, for shorter duration or both for the next leg. Keep in mind that we have a Model S 60 which is one of the shortest Range Teslas made. The newer and more expensive ones get much longer range and would allow you to drive further, stop less and charge quicker. My guess is that even with one of those you wouldn't really notice covering point A to point B any quicker across the country. I would venture a guess that you wouldn't even do it that much quicker in an ICE vehicle unless you were on some sort of cannonball run scenario where you're shitting your pants and pissing in bottles.

Oh yeah, did I mention that 2,500 miles didn't cost us a penny?

This is also road trips that we're talking about which make up well under 5% of use for most vehicle owners. Basing your vehicle purchase on the 1-2% of use is probably a bad idea for most. I hear stuff about "more range" a lot and I know that the way the technology is advancing we'll see "more range" next year, then the year after, etc. What we have no is perfectly adequate just most every driver out there if they're honest with themselves. These cars will do the 98-99% day in and day out w/o batting an eyelash and will give you a better experience.

To top it off, I can't really explain it but we were NOT tired from driving at all after 10-12hrs in the seat each day. This is something I never experienced in a regular ICE car. Something about the engine noise, exhaust note, droning, vibrations, etc. I would notice fatigue on anything but the shortest local drives. Scottsbluff, NE for us is about 2.5 hours one-way. Often times we would make the trip, enjoy a few hours with family and then drive back the same day. After only 5hrs in the saddle and a few hours of sitting around eating and talking we'd be beat. This (along with MANY things) are things that you don't really see as abnormal because that's just the way they've always been.

The Tesla Model S is the best car I've ever driven. Period.

[Jer]

Having taken my truck to the salvage yard where they unload you with a giant magnet, I wonder what would happen to an EV.

Also a short bed sucks for towing 5th wheels no matter the drive train.

In what aspect? They're both made of similar materials so it would be pretty similar. Do you mean the computers and such or do you mean that the truck would just fall apart in general if you asked it to haul that much?

[Jer]

My biggest issue with EVs is the charging time. My vacation is typically 2100 miles round trip. The less time I have to spend sitting still, the better. I can get 400 miles of recharge in 10 minutes and be on my way.

So you will actually take a 2,100 mile trip and stop only 5 times for 10 minutes each time for a grand total of 50 minutes?

[00tec]

So you will actually take a 2,100 mile trip and stop only 5 times for 10 minutes each time for a grand total of 50 minutes?

Unless there is an emergency piss stop and our destinations, yes.

Did this recently. Left 12/7 for Haskell, TX. Stayed for a few days, left for Kilgore, TX. After a few days, visited Jacksonville TX. Another few to Bandera, TX. Returned on 12/16.
If you take a peek at those areas and the routes between, the EV charging infrastructure isn't really there, without further delays.
Would I like an EV for my 70 mile round trip commute? Sure, but all of our family is spread out in relatively rural areas that it doesn't work for us, as we visit multiple times a year.

[Irving]

I like the idea of off road vehicles, but how realistic would it be to camp for a week like when hunting? My early hunting trip I bring extra fuel and top up at the cabin. On days with lots of driving I've had to stop in a small town to refuel.

Let me start over. How about something like Jeep Easter Safari where you are camping at night and wheeling all day. The wheeling isn't mileage heavy, but you're still living out of your vehicle for days.

Of course those aren't normal driving conditions, but since we're talking about things you couldn't currently do with an EV. Even all those examples I gave don't really mean much because most people who have that hobby have a second vehicle for those kinds of trips anyway.

[MrPrena]

There are 3 types of Tesla haters.

1. Idiots who just think driving ev or hybrid as Faxgxxx or Queex.
2. People who doesn't like ev because of governerment tax credit for buyer and some kinda subsidies for manufacturers.
Hate the game, not the player.
3. People who bet agaist Tesla (TSLA Short Seller).
Nothing personal, it is all business to them. LONGs also call them "Shortards."


I can understand disliking the certain brand (preference) , BUT hating a car DRIVER for driving a Brand they don't like is just fuxking retarded.