"Electric Vehicles are Actually Worse for the Environment than Internal Combustion Cars"

[davsel]

https://www.nationalreview.com/2015/...s-phil-kerpen/

Thank you!

[Jer]

I gave it a try to read through this thread, can't do it. It's a neat idea, but it ain't gonna work out for everyone in the long run.

It's probably fun trying to convince everyone I suppose, and at the same time it seems like something I'd see on a libtard board too. The same board that has Vegan recipes and fun stuff on Etsy too.

If you think me a liberal because of my choice of vehicle then you clearly don't know enough about me as a person to make such generalizations.

What a clusterfuck, again.

Never fails man. Someone brings something to the table that goes against what others believe to be fact (based on what information is a mystery) and they're branded a lunatic. This is largely a defense mechanism to protect the delicate ego of those who can't handle having to reevaluate something they believe to be fact based on decades old information. If you believe in your information you should be willing and able to keep a level head while having a conversation about it with someone rather than resorting to name calling and personal attacks instead. This is how those who first presented evidence that the earth wasn't flat to those who refused to believe the data must have felt.

Any firemen here? You guys getting any special training on electric vehicles? The door handle thing aside, what about electric vehicle fires?

I know a few and was actually quite surprised by how few (from various departments) have had any training on EVs. This isn't cutting edge tech we're talking about as most of the vehicles on the roads today have been out for 7+ years now. I even point out the location they need to cut under the hood in the frunk to disable the 12v battery system should they need to and most had never seen it. Haters try to make it seem like EVs are rolling bombs but in reality all vehicles are forms of rolling bombs. You transport stored energy in one form or another and it's a potential fire/hazard so this is a problem all modern transportation faces. A necessary evil if you want to get from point A to point B faster we've come to accept.

I still think bio diesel is the way to go. Algae produces an oil. Just feed it sewage and biowaste. Same algae that made fossil fuels. 7000 plus batteries to power an EV? Seems overly complicated to me. Maybe some quantum computing of lithium cell design is in order?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solid-state_battery

I like the potential of this but I also feel like we've heard about this our whole life and it's really not grown any legs. If there is something to this I think we would have seen more advancements by now but maybe that's just lack of funding or drive. Dunno?

What I do know is that if it's a fuel for a diesel system there are still a LOT of moving parts to that solution. You say that 7k batteries is complex and to me it's the opposite. It's quite literally one single item with no moving parts replicated thousands of times and then managed on an individual basis via software and computers that have the power to manage each one individually. Sounds complex to someone who doesn't understand the concept but once you see that it's not witchcraft and is indeed complex for the engineers and programmers but in practice the package is quite simple with very few moving parts to complicate things or break down.

That's one of the big detractors IMO for ICE (to include ANY fuel source, even your algae example) is the thousands of moving parts, most all being unique, and any of of them that fail can render the entire system inoperable. An EV has only dozens or possibly hundreds of moving parts depending on the complexity of the "features/options" offered. Simple math tells you fewer moving parts is more reliable and real world data supports it. If you spin a rod bearing in an ICE vehicle you're stranded. If one of the 7,000 cells in the array fail the computer takes it out of commission and recovers it via charge/discharge and can entirely disable it for safety if that ever becomes an issue. All of this happens behind the scenes and unknown to the end user. The result is something that's complicated on paper (especially if you or I had to egniener it alone) but quite simple in use.

Hydrogen powdered?

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/02/21/...ten-tesla.html

Musk doesnt like them, so there maybe so truth to the article?

There's some true bits to this but, as is with most of these "news" articles these days whose sole mission is to get clicks, a lot of what was said was taken out of context.

My personal stance is that this should be the direction for larger applications and electric power isn't ideal for something like a long-haul semi tractor trailer. Elon has even agreed in the past that this would likely be the most efficient power source for this application but that they don't build hydrogen vehicles so they're taking what they know and applying it to a better solution since nobody else seems motivated to innovate. The hope is that this will spur someone else to build a better mousetrap faster so to speak. That's kind of the larger overall stated intent of Tesla as an entity is to accelerate the curve towards sustainable energy. He's even been on record (to the stock's determent) of saying that he has dumped millions of his own dollars into the company fully expecting it to fail but that it was important for humanity. Fast forward several years though and Tesla is turning a profit and is even prepared for the impending world-wide recession that we're poised to see (the layoffs that all of the haters assume is signs of trouble) so there's far less concerns of failure now than there was say 5-6 years ago.

Why is the concept of an electric vehicle "liberal minded?"

Good question.

But will they have windows on them?

Bazinga!

So because he like EVs then he has to be Liberal?

You know me... big ol' patchouli smoking tree-hugger that lives in Boulder and grew up in the big city!

What?s the point of this thread? Honestly. To say Electric cars aren?t too bad. Or to say people that don?t agree with electric cars are
Dumb?

It's quite simple: provide some facts for those who care to know the full story in order to make up their own mind. Too many people spout BS they heard from a guy as fact and for more are willing to believe this and parrot it to the point it gets spoken in reality. There are a few in this forum who actually find these sorts of topics interesting even if they aren't verbal about it. Some will ask questions and if I know the answer I'm happy to help wherever possible. It should be a simple conversation but for some reason a select few get very emotional and then project their emotion onto me because if they're emotional then I must be too, right? Not sure where the aggression comes from but it's not a place of stability & reason.

If you just drive a boring car to work then you might as well buy an EV, I drive a boring car in a boring commute everyday, that's why I also plan to buy one.

This is basically the wheelhouse of EV since so many have been budget minded and cookie cutter type utilitarian before Tesla came along. You can pick up used EVs in the $10k or less range these days if all you care about is point A to point B and you'll probably be amazed at how well it performs this most basic of tasks that most will use their car for 99% of the time. Personally I just don't like cookie cutter cars so I wasn't as interested in that style of EV but that doesn't mean I can't see the value to someone who does.

Same as any thread on General forum, information for us, what we think of it is our business.

Someone gets it.

Thank you!

For what? Posting up an link to a post from over four years ago that is by and large fabricated BS then with skewed numbers that are outdated now? You mean to tell me you couldn't find something to fit that bill? They're everywhere! lol

Here's a more recent post with more recent information that addresses a few of the "points" made in that link above:

Click me for information on the "Tesla subsidies"

It should be noted that this was basically the first think that came up in Google and there are TONS of similar and fact-based reads if you genuinely care to learn more. I could search for and post dozens but if you don't read one with an objective mindset what does it matter?