Did Russia influence the election?

[OtterbatHellcat]

You're a thoughtful and inquisitive person, Irving. I admire that.

I get where you're coming from, and it's also an example of what I just said at the same time. It's cool, man.

[FoxtArt]

Bolstering beliefs and echo chambers seems limited to the modern era, but it's basic cognitive dissonance. Everyone suffers it to some extent, it is an adaptation in our biology (surviving in periods of time when our situations were not changeable, e.g. make lemonade out of lemons) In certain types of the population it seems to have been increasing in severity, but that is not backed in any study. Basically (most) people severely modify reality to conform to their beliefs - finding excuses to discard facts that disagree with their current mind set, and finding excuses to believe facts that are otherwise unbelievable. Our political issues today can almost entirely be pointed at this syndrome, but it's not limited to D, R, or anyone else. This is the same reason why mothers will also usually protect a boyfriend when confronted with an abuse accusation of their own child. (the fact that their boyfriend/spouse could abuse their child is too drastic of a change to their currently accepted belief). This is the same reason people suffering Nigerian scammers refuse to believe they have been scammed and keep sending money - and hesitate to believe it even after it's been proven and their family intercedes.

This is also precisely what Russia has been exploiting for a long time - and yes, very heavily on social media, among many other mediums. Their goal is to increase discord, with the end game of a dis-functional, or potentially even entirely divided U.S, which no longer poses a threat to their own country. The D's are incorrect thinking it's only election influence upon the R side, while the R's are incorrect in believing there is none, or it is limited. Things like "Q", "BLM", "Antifa", etc. they have heavy troll involvement on, in all sides. Basically if you begin to start a controversy - including mass shootings and guns, or a conspiracy (like Q) Russia will divert a lot of resources into trolling all sides and trying to piss people off. I also heavily suspect that "Q" is entirely created by the Russia, tbh. The more people that fall into the dissonance trap and treat the divisiveness like a faith-based religion of hate on both sides, the more that they succeed.

[Justin]

Tribalism is certainly not restricted to any one party. The point is that when people don't talk to each other in person where usually things remain polite enough to at least have a discussion, they go back to their online echo chambers where the outside influence runs wide and deep.

Not entirely true.

Studies and analysis of social media data have found that, by and large, those who lean conservative or libertarian tend to follow outlets and engage with people who are outside of their political spectrum, but not the other way around.

On top of that, by and large Red Tribe types have no choice in whether they engage with Blue Tribe ideals; after all, the press, the music industry, film and television are all managed by people who inject Blue Tribe politics into their products. Furthermore, Silicon Valley is heavily in the tank for the Blue Tribe, and this comes through in spades when you examine the policies that they implement on social media platforms like Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube where they've been steadily closing the Overton Window on "acceptable" conservative and libertarian ideas through the use of shadow bans, deplatforming, demonetization, and outright bans.

Frankly, your assertion that conservative types don't engage with leftist concepts, ideas, and policies is flat out ridiculous.

[Irving]

Justin, please post a link for said: " Studies and analysis of social media data have found that, by and large, those who lean conservative or libertarian tend to follow outlets and engage with people who are outside of their political spectrum, but not the other way around."

I don't know where to find it, but one example is among left wing journalists who have been found to only follow other left wing journalists in their social media circles, where as conservatives would follow people from both sides. That opens up the discussion about whom is more out of touch with the world and them and should be especially embarrassing for journalists.

Justin, you've been on here a long time. You can't tell me with a straight face that you've never seen members of this very board talking about how they've, over the years, unfriended all the people they don't agree with politically; first on social media, then eventually culling friends in real life.

Obviously we can't broad brush every person into a certain behavior, but to cherry pick what I actually said (people tend to retire to their own camp) to say that it's flat out ridiculous that conservatives don't interact with the other side is equally ridiculous.

You think the might be a difference between a publicly elected politician and a rancher in his 60's and what people they tend to mingle with?

[Justin]

Justin, please post a link for said: " Studies and analysis of social media data have found that, by and large, those who lean conservative or libertarian tend to follow outlets and engage with people who are outside of their political spectrum, but not the other way around."

Democrats Are 3 Times More Likely to Unfriend You on Social Media, Survey Says
http://fortune.com/2016/12/19/social-media-election/

Liberals are more likely to unfriend you over politics — online and off ...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...nline-and-off/

Poll: Dems more likely to unfriend people due to political posts
https://thehill.com/homenews/311047-...olitical-posts

“Merry Christmas” vs. “Happy Holidays”: Republicans and Democrats are Polar Opposites
https://www.prri.org/research/poll-p...war-christmas/

[Justin]

I don't know where to find it, but one example is among left wing journalists who have been found to only follow other left wing journalists in their social media circles, where as conservatives would follow people from both sides. That opens up the discussion about whom is more out of touch with the world and them and should be especially embarrassing for journalists.

I'd not heard that, but I find it completely unsurprising.

Justin, you've been on here a long time. You can't tell me with a straight face that you've never seen members of this very board talking about how they've, over the years, unfriended all the people they don't agree with politically; first on social media, then eventually culling friends in real life.

A half-dozen cranky old farts on a lightly trafficed social media backwater don't even amount to a rounding error.

Obviously we can't broad brush every person into a certain behavior, but to cherry pick what I actually said (people tend to retire to their own camp) to say that it's flat out ridiculous that conservatives don't interact with the other side is equally ridiculous.

Sorry dude, but the data was collated. You can see the links above. And it is flat out ridiculous to claim that conservatives don't have interaction with the other side. Statistically, leftists are more likely to stay in their echo chambers than conservatives on social media. Additionally, short of living completely off the grid with zero interaction with current culture, there is no way to avoid leftwing/Blue Tribe talking points.

Consevatives have no recourse but to interact with Blue Tribe ideals if they want to actually take part in society.

Or do you really want to try to argue that TV, movies, the internet, tv news, newspapers, etc. have anything approaching a semblance of objectivity or balance?

You think the might be a difference between a publicly elected politician and a rancher in his 60's and what people they tend to mingle with?

Not particularly relevant to the situation at hand.

[Irving]

I think with the vast majority of media outlets leaning left, it's pretty easy to watch a wider variety of news sources without leaving your political bubble if you're on the left.

[Irving]

On a lighter note, if anyone wants to hear what it would be like if Great Kazoo ever went onto Joe Rogan, listen to the episode with comedian Nick DiPaolo.

[BushMasterBoy]

Maybe it is just an protozoan. 25% of the US is infected on average.


https://academic.oup.com/aje/article/154/4/357/62015

[MrPrena]

I have both side of wack jobs of political spectrum.
Sadly both nuts mainly care about social issues and not the economy.

Stupid.