Denver decriminalizes mushrooms!

[FoxtArt]

Driving by the main convo to establish a fact:

You can't compare drug issue preclusion (e.g. Amendment 64 is just an affirmative defense) with e.g. Montana style firearm regulation or second amendment "sanctuary counties"

The difference is, people grow pot left and right here, take pictures, and are proud of it. The feds won't regulate it despite their laws because it would be politically devastating. There is 0.0000% risk of any negative ramification to any user, no matter how "disagreeable" they are.

However, the "second amendment sanctuary" crap, the Montana style legislation, all of that is nothing more than pandering to conservative votes, it is utterly without any meaning or effect. If you manufacture a full-auto in one of those places for instance, and brag about it on facebook.... you have a pretty short clock ticking on your freedom. It's probably worse than just the open knowledge of enforcement, because it also even moreso enables selective enforcement - something you don't see on the drug issues. What do I mean? Lets say you get pulled over in Montana for having Colorado MJ in your car, and you have a Montana-manufactured suppressor without a tax stamp. What are you going to get prosecuted for? What's going to cost you far more? Yeah, that's what you get with that conservative vote pandering... counties are not obligated to abide by it, fed gov't are not going to abide by it, state it not obligated to abide by it, so there's just a few yokum's that get the false belief they can do what they want, yet the same old venus people-trap has got it's maw open... and certainly, anyone that is "disagreeable" would never get any imagined protections even if they did exist in any fashion.

[CHA-LEE]

Totally agree. However, I would add that not one penny of tax money would go to toward treatment, punishment, nor rehabilitation of users. Make them pay 100% for their own consequences.

Absolutely agree. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

[CHA-LEE]

Liberty is all well and good, but when you're dealing with substances capable of short circuiting and then significantly rewiring the pleasure centers of the human brain with only a handful of uses, arguments for personal responsibility go right out the window.

How is this any different than playing a game of hot potato with lit stick of dynamite. That is equally fatal. Just because something is dangerous or has the potential of causing permanent brain damage it doesn't justify making it illegal. If someone wants to drink a gallon of gas because it makes them high and they die because of it, that is their choice is it not. We will always live in a universe filled with "Good" or "Bad" choices to make. If someone chooses to make a "Bad" choice, they are rewarded with the consequences. In short, don't be an idiot or you will pay the price. That reality will never change regardless of what laws exist.

[CHA-LEE]

Plenty of people start without knowing what the consequences are, or vastly underestimate their understanding of them. Humans are hugely short-sighted creatures, so I don't buy your argument that anyone, perhaps short of a full-on medical doctor, decides to undertake the use of addicitive substances in any sort of headspace approaching full-on understanding of the consequences.

Further, differences in biology mean that there's no way to know how you'll react. There are some people who shoot heroine, or smoke crack or meth recreationally and never get addicted, or even if they are addicted, they're able to hold down a job and manage their drug use.

On the other hand, there are people who end up destroying their lives, and the lives of those around them due to an addiction.

CHA-LEE's position may be morally and philosophically consistent, but it does nothing to take into account the fact that humans aren't rational actors, even at the best of times, and expecting someone with a drug addiction to be a rational actor is utterly inconsistent with what is known about neurochemistry. Hell, a 2 minute conversation with literally any smoker will tell you that.

So more laws are going to magically change human nature? If its human nature for people to do stupid shit while ignoring potential consequences, then it is what it is. There is also the fact that there will always be the unlucky portion of people who's suffering and sacrifice serve as roll models of how NOT to do it. Using and abusing illegal substances is WELL KNOWN to cause a wide range of issues. People know this at a very young age. Nobody is growing up in a complete information/warning vacuum then also have access to drugs and think using them is a good thing to do. Every one of those addicts made a choice to use them for the first time knowing full well that it could cause trouble.

Is it tragic that peoples lives are destroyed by using illegal substances? Absolutely. But the situation being "tragic" doesn't justify ignoring the fact that they have 100% done it to themselves. If I decided to take up a hobby of juggling chainsaws running full throttle, I can't expect anyone to have pity for me when I end up sawing off appendages. I need to live with the choice I made to participate in that activity. Drug use is no different.

[Irving]

Has anyone ever been addicted to mushrooms? Real question.

[Great-Kazoo]

Has anyone ever been addicted to mushrooms? Real question.

Availability use to be based on growing season time frame. With grow houses who knows what that is

Look anyone who likes something more normal and requires their needs met, is an addict. Some are addicted to alcohol, cigarettes, vaping, drugs or guns.

To most a few of those are illegal, federally. To others, guns should be illegal. Which addiction is good or bad for the individual?

Now for those who are addicted to drugs or alcohol, it makes no difference what the availability is on the street. They will always find something to substitute their addiction with.

Can't find oxy's, hit the street for some junk. Can't buy booze, look no further than the medicine cabinet or cleaning supplies. Addicts are addicts, doesn't matter how many programs they do. They're 1 foot from falling off the wagon , if even that.

[davsel]

[ChickNorris]

Flirt

[Justin]

How is this any different than playing a game of hot potato with lit stick of dynamite. That is equally fatal. Just because something is dangerous or has the potential of causing permanent brain damage it doesn't justify making it illegal. If someone wants to drink a gallon of gas because it makes them high and they die because of it, that is their choice is it not. We will always live in a universe filled with "Good" or "Bad" choices to make. If someone chooses to make a "Bad" choice, they are rewarded with the consequences. In short, don't be an idiot or you will pay the price. That reality will never change regardless of what laws exist.

Part of having a functional society is constructing it in such a way that bad choices aren't so easy that your entire society ends up collapsing under the collective weight of a significant portion of your society making horrible choices and then offloading the consequences on to others.

Hell, look at the obesity epidemic. This country's food system is so absolutely fucked up that food with zero nutritional value is cheaper and more available than food that is decent.

Same thing with drugs. If the shit's everywhere, a certain percent of the population is going to be more likely to make the shitty choice than the right one, especially if they have to make that choice multiple times per day. This would go even more so for people who are former addicts trying to recover.

While I have serious misgivings about the war on drugs, the libertarian line about legalizing it and letting nature take it's course simply doesn't fly, mostly because the argument fails to take into account the web of negative externalities generated by easily available drugs; everything from increased domestic violence, sexual assault, property crimes, etc. etc.

Hell, I have to put up with that on my daily commute where I've been hassled by homeless idiots who are begging for pot money (at least if their signs are to be believed.)

[Justin]

Availability use to be based on growing season time frame. With grow houses who knows what that is

Look anyone who likes something more normal and requires their needs met, is an addict. Some are addicted to alcohol, cigarettes, vaping, drugs or guns.

To most a few of those are illegal, federally. To others, guns should be illegal. Which addiction is good or bad for the individual?

Now for those who are addicted to drugs or alcohol, it makes no difference what the availability is on the street. They will always find something to substitute their addiction with.

Can't find oxy's, hit the street for some junk. Can't buy booze, look no further than the medicine cabinet or cleaning supplies. Addicts are addicts, doesn't matter how many programs they do. They're 1 foot from falling off the wagon , if even that.

Mushrooms are not physically addictive.