RMGO Stoops to New Low...

[Ronin13]

Rich doesn't define RMGO.

But his conduct shed's a bad light on RMGO... I would love to support you and your organization for all the good it does and represents for 2A and Gun Owners, not just here in CO but all over the country. However, I will remind you that it's not 100% what you do, it's what some of those members do that could hurt the reputation. If someone like Larry Phillips, Jr. and Emil Mătăsăreanu, the men that committed the North Hollywood Shootout back in 1997, was a member of RMGO and did something like that believe me the left would have a field day and rally against your cause. I know that's an extreme example, but it has happened before and will happen again, it's just a matter of time before some nut, who just so happens to be a member of RMGO, NRA, [insert pro-gun group here], does something to bring shame to their organization. You can say this is a rare case and not all of our members are like that, but the general public (Read: Sheeple) may not see it like that and just brand everyone as "that guy."

I'm not saying be a jerk and carefully screen folks that intend to join, I'm saying the ones with a bad reputation and near unforgivable faults should be dismissed or denied. All dealings with Mr. Wyatt seem to be negative, and to the uneducated who wants to join RMGO will see him and think "Well if this org supports him and allows him in, I don't really think I want to support them." Just my .02, I've seen how one bad apple can ruin the whole lot.

[RMGOdirector]

Apparently the American public disagrees with you (that those shows are enough), since all of the shows combined don't bring in 1/10th the viewership of Sons of Guns (which, I understand, is why this TV show is being produced).

Personally, I don't watch much TV at all (outside of Hockey, Top Gear and Larry Vickers' program), so I'm not a good test case.

Whether you like those TV shows or not, you don't get a vote (nor do I) as to whether Gurney Productions is doing this TV show. They are.

That's the wonderful thing about America -- you aren't forced to watch anything.

[RMGOdirector]

All dealings with Mr. Wyatt seem to be negative, and to the uneducated who wants to join RMGO will see him and think "Well if this org supports him and allows him in, I don't really think I want to support them." Just my .02, I've seen how one bad apple can ruin the whole lot.

As I've stated earlier, Wyatt has quite a number of people who like him and buy only from him. Many of them have contacted me about the TV show, saying "atta boy Rich".

[Ronin13]

As I've stated earlier, Wyatt has quite a number of people who like him and buy only from him. Many of them have contacted me about the TV show, saying "atta boy Rich".

Dudley, not big on the debate huh? I've met people who were loyal and avid customers of Gunsmoke (and conversely Rich) and the first few times they did business there they were pleased, until they found that they 1- paid way too much for the same firearm that could have been purchased elsewhere for less, 2- discovered his bad business habits and he and his employee's tendency to talk condescendingly toward customers, even knowledgeable ones (some of the experiences I've had as well). If you want to be friends with him, go for it, but don't cry to me when RMGO gets pegged with bad press on account of Rich Wyatt.
Just looked on BBB's site at Gunsmoke, shocking A+ given for them... odd I would say.

[RMGOdirector]

I love to debate, but I think we've all established our position.

Plus, I'm about ready to go to NYC to go to the UN Arms Trade Treaty. Blech.

[hollohas]

Apparently the American public disagrees with you (that those shows are enough), since all of the shows combined don't bring in 1/10th the viewership of Sons of Guns (which, I understand, is why this TV show is being produced).

Personally, I don't watch much TV at all (outside of Hockey, Top Gear and Larry Vickers' program), so I'm not a good test case.

Whether you like those TV shows or not, you don't get a vote (nor do I) as to whether Gurney Productions is doing this TV show. They are.

That's the wonderful thing about America -- you aren't forced to watch anything.

Hum, is this in response to me mentioning the good firearms related shows on Outdoor Channel? I'll assume it was...

I didn't say they were enough...in fact I wish there were more like them as well as on larger networks. I didn't complain about this new show or you supporting it. Instead, I mentioned those other shows because they fit the bill for the type of show some here expressed interest in having. I mentioned them because in my view they are good gun tv and more people should watch them.

Many people here will not support this new show, will not support Wyatt and some won't support your organization based on their perception of your alignment with the two, that is up to them. I'll reserve my judgement. I will however help steer people that are interested in watching and supporting great gun tv in the right direction. No "reality", no "casting", just good gun tv.

PS Dudley - On a personal note, I was a RMGO supporter (I think my membership has expired and not by accident) but I really would like to suggest new tactics. I don't want to get in a pissing contest I simply want to give you my opinion as to how I think you can win more support. It is worth what you paid for it...

The thing that comes to the front of your emails is the request for money and the scare tactics to get it. I don't know what you do to protect the 2A because you don't give many specifics in your emails. One email comes to mind. You once mentioned the BATF wanted to take away our shotguns (which we have all heard about). The way you suggested we help stop it? To buy a book. You are using our money to fight the good fight and the best thing you can come up with is for us to buy a book?

Not once in the email did you give any sources, links or actual information. I suggest you add these things to your emails. Is there a bill being introduced somewhere? A memo from the BATF? Quotes? Newspaper articles? Put that info in your emails. You make us believe you have inside info...so why not share it with us? How are you going to use our donations and proceeds from the book to fight it? I know about this issue because I did MY OWN research. But you supplied me with NOTHING to fight it...no info, no facts, you just want money so YOU can fight it. Get us involved to better our odds. Tell us what specifically you are doing instead of just "RMGO is fighting this and we need your money." Your email updates are too vague.

Tell us who to write letters to. Tell us some facts or where to find them so we can form intelligent arguments when writing our representatives. Give us the tools to be members in the fight. You are the coach but you aren't helping us players get off the sidelines and actually contribute anything more than money. If you gave me real tangible information I would certainly join again and donate more. I'm not from Missouri but you really need to show me more.

[hollohas]

I'm about ready to go to NYC to go to the UN Arms Trade Treaty. Blech.

Ah, there we go. Some information about what RMGO is doing.

Are you going on a fact finding mission? Are you participating in some way? Are you meeting with any important people while there? Can we help by contacting anyone? This is the type of info I suggested you give us in my previous post...

How about an email telling what you learned and what you accomplished when you get back instead of just an email saying "The UN wants to take your guns. RMGO is fighting it and we need your support." We all know that already...

Am I asking for too much from an organization who would like my money and support?

[RMGOdirector]

I posted a "What RMGO does" on this forum, in a separate thread.

RMGO did a series of e-mails about the Shotgun ban, as well as the multiple rifle reporting requirements, telling people to contact the BATFE during the comment period.

Don't mind suggestions about how to do things. However, if they include "don't ask for money and you'll get more of mine" I will politely tell people "Great idea, but it doesn't work."

To your specific suggestion about including backup documentation: there are two problems with that.

1. If you provide a link on the issue, you lose people. They get lost in the internet, following a bunny trail. Simple actions make for more actions. Wish that weren't the case, but try making your living on internet marketing by going against the tide, and you'll be the hungry man living in a refrigerator box under a bypass.

2. Often in political issues there IS no documentation.

Case in point: prior to the 2004 sunset of the AW ban, the NRA was cutting a deal (in a desperate attempt to pass the Lawsuits Liability bill) that would have re-authorized the Assault Weapons ban.

They weren't dumb enough to write out the deal, and were VERY careful to cover their tracks. Most politicians, and the political class, are, especially when selling out their base.

So, by the time most political information has been fleshed out and proven beyond a reasonable doubt, it is too late. The fix is in (can you say "Brady Law"???).

This isn't a crackpot JBS theory on how politics works.

It's a first hand, quarter of a century observation, with real world experience. I didn't learn it on Fox news, I've lived it.

But, I'll agree with you that we should have followed up with more documentation. I plead "mea culpa" on that one.

[RMGOdirector]

Ah, there we go. Some information about what RMGO is doing.

Are you going on a fact finding mission? Are you participating in some way? Are you meeting with any important people while there? Can we help by contacting anyone? This is the type of info I suggested you give us in my previous post...

How about an email telling what you learned and what you accomplished when you get back instead of just an email saying "The UN wants to take your guns. RMGO is fighting it and we need your support." We all know that already...

Am I asking for too much from an organization who would like my money and support?

That's what RMGO's e-mail list is for. This isn't our forum, after all.

I may not "learn" anything. My goal is to produce a short video, with interviews, on this very issue.

The producer of the video is the producer of this film (which, incidentally, is coming out in September): UN Me

[HBARleatherneck]

i think the RMGO threads have run their course. how about locking them now?