Possible first time buyer... need input.

[sneakerd]

Sorry- I think I managed to hijack the thread.

[HoneyBadger]

I think it comes down to personal preference in what you intend to do with it eventually. My opinion (JUST MY OPINION... LET'S NOT START A FLAME WAR) is the following:

AK-47 - is very unlikely to ever break/jam/wear out to unshootability. They have an excellent reputation for reliability under adverse conditions (humidity, sand, not being cleaned for thousands of rounds). And replacement parts are still cheap, even if the guns themselves are currently overpriced. The downside is that you will never get great accuracy from an AK chambered in standard 7.63x39. The round and the gun itself do not lend themselves to match-accuracy. In today's panic market, expect to pay between $900-$1500.

AR-15 - I've owned two (Bushmaster Dissipator and a Rock River m4) and sold both due to reliability issues. They need to be cleaned/lubed frequently to stay reliable, some are questionable with steel-cased ammo, and it's a matter of when, not if, the bolt wears out. I've heard different numbers on round counts for that happening. The upside is, if you get a reliable one, the accuracy potential is incredible, particularly with some easy mods like getting a free-floating handguard (just a handguard that doesn't contact the barrel). They're also like "Lego guns" in that your average person can easily modify/replace/upgrade every part on them, without being a gunsmith. Price today: between $1200-$3000

SKS - lots of people go this route for a budget gun. They typically fire the same round that an AK does, and it is possible to modify them to accept hi-cap AK mags. Some of them come ready-made to a use AK mags from the factory. They're not as light and portable as a typical AK, (due to the wood stock, heavier receiver) and typically have sub-par accuracy. I've owned several of these over the years and never had any reliability issues. They're just not my gun of choice. Plus, if you're bony like me - the steel plate one the buttstock necessitates a recoil pad of some sort. Your clavicle will thank you, even with a relatively low-recoil round like 7.62x39. Price: $400-800.

If I had to make a choice between all three for a "do-everything" gun, I would grab an AK-74. It's an AK-47 chambered in a round which is similar to the 5.56 (What most AR-15's shoot), but is vastly cheaper. You get the benefit of a lighter/faster round, which is purported to do excellent tissue damage (I couldn't qualify that - haven't had to shoot anybody yet. :-) from the reports in Afghanistan, and is VASTLY cheaper than 90% of the rifle ammo out there. (1080 rounds can still be had for $250ish). The downside is that most of the ammo is corrosive, meaning that if you don't clean it in between shoots, it can degrade the internals/barrel of your gun. A simple spray-down with Windex after shooting will neutralize this problem.

Dingo, you must have terrible luck with ARs! I've owned 7 ARs over the past 8 years. I've sold most of them for a variety of reasons, but not a single one because of problems with reliablility or accuracy. Combined I've probably put 10k rounds through my ARs and never worn any of them out or had any major malfunctions or reliability problems. Every once in a while I got a FTF (failure to fire) or a FTE (failure to eject) because of crappy surplus ammo, but the rifle was not the cause of those rare issues. One of my Palmetto State ARs I've shot about 3500 rounds of surplus ammo through without any cleaning and it still works like a charm!

To Rob: I bought an expensive special-caliber AR as my first AR (a $2500 6.8x43mm custom AR-15) and I ended up selling it after buying a much cheaper 5.56 AR-15. It was ridiculously accurate: I could put 5 rounds through the same hole at 100yds. ...But it was heavy and expensive to shoot. I couldn't bear the cost of ammo (stocking up on 6.8 ammo is EXPENSIVE!) and things like magazines were much pricier than 5.56/.223 mags. I decided to consolidate 8 different calibers down to 4 to save money and make bulk buying easier. I tend to like the quality of ARs over AKs. Sometimes with imported firearms, you can't be sure of their build quality or quality of materials.... but sometimes those are the best ones when it comes to reliability and toughness.

If you don't have a ton of money to put into this, I would recommend building a AR-15 lower from parts (it's super easy and lots of forum members would be willing to help) and buying a complete upper from a company like Palmetto state armory. I have 2 of their uppers right now (I might have one of them up for sale in the trading post soon!) and one complete rifle from them... they all work great. Right now, you gotta take your time and shop around for the deals. Be patient and don't get robbed by the panic prices!

You don't have to spend a lot of money to get an AR that is really great: My favorite AR right now only cost me $1100 before the panic. It is lightweight, completely reliable, and pretty accurate (1.5 inch groups at 100yds with a 14.5" CL barrel)

[Madeinhb]

I just got a new S&W15T for MSRP. I know it's probably a little more than I would have paid, but nothing like the ridiculous price hikes going on. The trick is find one and if price is reasonable, get it.

[liberty19]

I tend to agree with most here that a basic AR15 is a good starter semi-auto. Not only are they Barbie for men, but they are fun to shoot and have little recoil. If you want something with a heavier punch, it is hard to beat a Springfield M1a. The ammo is more expensive but you can accessorize them to your heart's content - almost as much as an AR. Good luck finding a rifle to suit your needs and your desires. Welcome to the DARK side.

[jslo]

Seems like most are saying for a beginner, get a stripped lower and a complete upper. May I ask what is a "decent" price for a complete upper for the beginner. I know you get what you pay for but for someone wanting to see if it's a platform they want to check into what should one expect to pay for a complete build. Do you that build, do it for the joy, striving for the perfect firearm or do you do it to save $.

[muddywings]

I have an AK-47 from years ago but always wanted an AR. I did it the way jslo recommend even though a lot of people (not here) told me to buy a complete rifle to start out. I went overboard on my build as I'm a buy once cry once and don't think by building a stripped lower that you'll save money but it is an easy way to learn the basics.
The hardest decision after that was the upper. I bought complete from BCM but the hard part was the length and that is where the fun comes in with your own personal needs/wants. I asked a lot of noob questions, caught some flak (not here) but over all got some good advice and did a ton of research which was half the fun.

[HoneyBadger]

May I ask what is a "decent" price for a complete upper for the beginner.

Palmetto. State. Armory.

[cstone]

BCM produces a great upper for a reasonable price.

[Gman]

Bought my first AR as a complete rifle. I learned more about them at that time. Second AR was a stripped Stag Arms lower that I built out myself with selected parts of my choosing. Then I just picked up a complete RRA mid-length upper. Fun stuff.

[DireWolf]

Seems like most are saying for a beginner, get a stripped lower and a complete upper. May I ask what is a "decent" price for a complete upper for the beginner. I know you get what you pay for but for someone wanting to see if it's a platform they want to check into what should one expect to pay for a complete build. Do you that build, do it for the joy, striving for the perfect firearm or do you do it to save $.

I don't know that I've ever saved any money by building from stripped receivers, probably the opposite. But by building your own, aside from the fun aspect, you can put in the parts that you want without having to strip out other perfectly good ones and commit them to parts-bin limbo...