BOLO for "Woman infatuated with Columbine"

[whitewalrus]

Do credit card purchases usually show up the same day? Some of mine do, but some don't show up for several days. Usually it's the next day.

Mine show up right away as pending. A few days later they they are no longer pending. Credits seem to take longer.

[Skully]

Mine show up right away as pending. A few days later they they are no longer pending. Credits seem to take longer.

Those are not public, how fast does it take to get a warrant to search someones CC purchases?

While I think she was nuts, no major conspiracy here but something is not right, how it went down and the info we got, and the nonchalant introduction to the whole thing. It seemed overly hyped, she was not guilty of anything so they couldn't charge her? You make a threat against the Pres and they are at your freaking door. Red flag law, hello, guilty until proven innocent. Just something weird about it all and cant put my finger on it...................

[Bailey Guns]

Except:
(c) This subsection does not apply to the purchase, trade, or transfer of a rifle or shotgun by a resident of this state when the resident makes such purchase, trade, or transfer from a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer in another state.

I'm no lawyer but I believe you're reading that statute incorrectly. The FL statute starts by saying (I'm going to paraphrase parts that don't apply):

790.065 Sale and delivery of firearms.?
(1)(a) A licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer may not sell or deliver from her or his inventory at her or his licensed premises any firearm to another person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector, until she or he has:

1. Buyer must fill out a form

2. Dealer must collect fee

3. Requested NICS check

This is where I believe your quote runs into trouble...subsection 4:

4. Received a unique approval number for that inquiry from the Department of Law Enforcement, and recorded the date and such number on the consent form.

(b) However, if the person purchasing, or receiving delivery of, the firearm is a holder of a valid concealed weapons or firearms license pursuant to the provisions of s. 790.06 or holds an active certification from the Criminal Justice Standards and Training Commission as a ?law enforcement officer,? a ?correctional officer,? or a ?correctional probation officer? as defined in s. 943.10(1), (2), (3), (6), (7), (8), or (9), this subsection does not apply.
(c) This subsection does not apply to the purchase, trade, or transfer of a rifle or shotgun by a resident of this state when the resident makes such purchase, trade, or transfer from a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer in another state.

So it appears to me the section you quoted is simply saying subsection 4, getting the approval numbers, doesn't apply when the purchase is made in another state.

If you go way down to the bottom of the 790.065 to sub-section (13), it states:

(13) A person younger than 21 years of age may not purchase a firearm. The sale or transfer of a firearm to a person younger than 21 years of age may not be made or facilitated by a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer. A person who violates this subsection commits a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084. The prohibitions of this subsection do not apply to the purchase of a rifle or shotgun by a law enforcement officer or correctional officer, as those terms are defined in s. 943.10(1), (2), (3), (6), (7), (8), or (9), or a servicemember as defined in s. 250.01.

There is no provision below that which states an out of state purchase is exempt from the age limit.

It appears to me that the sale was not in compliance with FL law. But, again, that's just my interpretation of the law. I could very well be wrong.

[Bailey Guns]

Another thought that crossed my mind was this:

I wonder what effect all of the media hoopla had on this girl and the decisions she made. If I was in a strange place and heard the media and everyone else saying I was likely mentally disturbed, I had made threats, I was infatuated with the Columbine shootings, etc., I'd be pretty upset. If this girl was a bit unbalanced it just might've been enough to send her to the suicide route.

On the other hand, that also might've prevented her from doing something horrible to others. We'll just never know now.

[BushMasterBoy]

I figure when you come here and close the schools down for a couple hundred thousand public school students, that 3 letter agency with huge computing power gets involved. First camera I checked on COTRIP.org when this BOLO occured, was the I-70 and CO103 camera. I lived up there for a few years and it is beautiful. It just seems weird to die naked, alone and by suicide in such a cold and inhospitable place. My hypothesis is she was traumatized somehow. She had a PTSD reaction.
Supposedly 22 veterans a day commit suicide. First thing you hear when you call the VA phones, is press 7 if you feel suicidal. So I guess it is true.

[FoxtArt]

I'm no lawyer but I believe you're reading that statute incorrectly. The FL statute starts by saying (I'm going to paraphrase parts that don't apply):




So it appears to me the section you quoted is simply saying subsection 4, getting the approval numbers, doesn't apply when the purchase is made in another state.

If you go way down to the bottom of the 790.065 to sub-section (13), it states:



There is no provision below that which states an out of state purchase is exempt from the age limit.

It appears to me that the sale was not in compliance with FL law. But, again, that's just my interpretation of the law. I could very well be wrong.

You make good points, but it does get complicated, AFAIK interstate commerce laws superseded any such argument as to purchase requirements (and it would be a weak argument at best even if they didn't). What REALLY matters is the legal age of possession in FL, which like all states, I'd hazard a guess that Florida doesn't even have an age for long-guns. Interstate commerce doesn't require that CO dealers comply with FL purchase requirements or vice versa, and it AFAIK waives any need for or any type of commerce to comply with purchase requirements of other states. Otherwise we couldn't sell long-guns to any non-state resident, due to technicalities - e.g. you could argue we cannot comply with FL regulations because we don't have to record a NCIS number, we don't haves licenses to do business in their state, etcetera, etcetera someone else who cares could actually dive into Florida. That's true of all commerce. If we had to comply with FL's purchase requirements for fruit, no CO business could sell fruit to FL residents, or "MJ" for that matter.

That said, the ownership laws have to be fully complied with as far as firearms are concerned, as others have already pointed, - e.g. cannot sell firearms including 30 round magazines to CA residents, or unmodified AR-15's to Connecticut, etc., and if FL prohibited the possession of a long gun by someone under 21, you would have to comply with that too. The fact that FL blocks the sale inside of FL to 18-20 yo is irrelevant if 18-20yo are otherwise legally permitted to possess.

[Skully]

You make good points, but it does get complicated, AFAIK interstate commerce laws superseded any such argument as to purchase requirements (and it would be a weak argument at best even if they didn't). What REALLY matters is the legal age of possession in FL, which like all states, I'd hazard a guess that Florida doesn't even have an age for long-guns. Interstate commerce doesn't require that CO dealers comply with FL purchase requirements or vice versa, and it AFAIK waives any need for or any type of commerce to comply with purchase requirements of other states. Otherwise we couldn't sell long-guns to any non-state resident, due to technicalities - e.g. you could argue we cannot comply with FL regulations because we don't have to record a NCIS number, we don't haves licenses to do business in their state, etcetera, etcetera someone else who cares could actually dive into Florida. That's true of all commerce. If we had to comply with FL's purchase requirements for fruit, no CO business could sell fruit to FL residents, or "MJ" for that matter.

That said, the ownership laws have to be fully complied with as far as firearms are concerned, as others have already pointed, - e.g. cannot sell firearms including 30 round magazines to CA residents, or unmodified AR-15's to Connecticut, etc., and if FL prohibited the possession of a long gun by someone under 21, you would have to comply with that too. The fact that FL blocks the sale inside of FL to 18-20 yo is irrelevant if 18-20yo are otherwise legally permitted to possess.

More points to the argument but we can let the lawyers argue all the laws applicable, it was said early we can probably guarantee legal action from family. There is lawyers probably already salivating on the family's doorstep to make a name for themselves. I wish it was not so, sympathy for the dealer on this.

[newracer]

Reported on the news tonight that ATF has reviewed the sale and deemed it was a legal sale. Said the Florida law only applies when the purchaser is in Florida.

[Gman]

Indeed. Florida law applies to Florida. Since when does Florida state law supersede Colorado state law...in Colorado?

[Skully]

Reported on the news tonight that ATF has reviewed the sale and deemed it was a legal sale. Said the Florida law only applies when the purchaser is in Florida.

Phew! relief for the dealer. Still a civil suit on its own may still be damaging. Anyone been to this dealer? Anyone on here works there? I have never been there, too far south for my donkeys travels.