Amendment 64...

[MarkCO]

What is your reason to think that legal pot will drive designer drug production? And, what will be the difference between the designer drugs now, and in the future?

When the profitabilty of pot is decreased, the same people will very likely move on to other drugs with a higher potential for profit. Legalization is not going to all of a sudden make drug dealers a beneficial element of society. With the proliferation of designer drugs in the recent years, and the shipment of bulk chemicals from other countries for that purpose, there is a wider and simpler path to cash for drug dealers with designer drugs, which have become much more toxic and powerful in just the last few years.

[xring]

When the profitabilty of pot is decreased, the same people will very likely move on to other drugs with a higher potential for profit. Legalization is not going to all of a sudden make drug dealers a beneficial element of society. With the proliferation of designer drugs in the recent years, and the shipment of bulk chemicals from other countries for that purpose, there is a wider and simpler path to cash for drug dealers with designer drugs, which have become much more toxic and powerful in just the last few years.

As I have stated earlier I believe marijuana to be a powerful drug with significant addiction risk. Marijuana is the drug of choice for about 8 out of 10 illicit drug users. It is my opinion that if marijuana was to be legalized a large percentage of users would be content with use of only legal drugs, just like many citizens are content to use only alcohol now. In my opinion there would be limited demand for the illegal "powerful, toxic designer drugs" you describe. Are 80% of illicit drug users going to abandon their drug of choice once it becomes legal and seek out illegal "powerful toxic designer drugs"? What I believe will happen if marijuana becomes legal is the majority of illicit marijuana users will have a strong incentive to use the only two legal drugs,marijuana and alcohol, shun criminal activities, and be overjoyed that they are no longer a criminal.

1;Its their drug of choice to begin with
2;They would not have to associate with the scumbag criminals to obtain it.
3;They would not face the risk of criminal prosecution .

The motivation is exactly the same that keeps the majority of citizens using the one legal drug available now, alcohol. In my opinion illicit drug use would strongly decline with the legalization of marijuana and the power and profits of the cartels along with it. The real question in my mind is whether legalization of marijuana and its subsequent addiction problems is worth the benefits of decriminalization of marijuana users. Imho the answer is overwhelminly yes, despite my distaste for potheads, or drunks for that matter.

[MarkCO]

As I have stated earlier I believe marijuana to be a powerful drug with significant addiction risk. Marijuana is the drug of choice for about 8 out of 10 illicit drug users. It is my opinion that if marijuana was to be legalized a large percentage of users would be content with use of only legal drugs, just like many citizens are content to use only alcohol now. In my opinion there would be limited demand for the illegal "powerful, toxic designer drugs" you describe. Are 80% of illicit drug users going to abandon their drug of choice once it becomes legal and seek out illegal "powerful toxic designer drugs"? What I believe will happen if marijuana becomes legal is the majority of illicit marijuana users will have a strong incentive to use the only two legal drugs,marijuana and alcohol, shun criminal activities, and be overjoyed that they are no longer a criminal.

1;Its their drug of choice to begin with
2;They would not have to associate with the scumbag criminals to obtain it.
3;They would not face the risk of criminal prosecution .

The motivation is exactly the same that keeps the majority of citizens using the one legal drug available now, alcohol. In my opinion illicit drug use would strongly decline with the legalization of marijuana and the power and profits of the cartels along with it. The real question in my mind is whether legalization of marijuana and its subsequent addiction problems is worth the benefits of decriminalization of marijuana users. Imho the answer is overwhelminly yes, despite my distaste for potheads, or drunks for that matter.

So I take it you don't have kids...

For many, the "forbidden" IS the drive. Legalization, in total, probably won't change the total use, but it will likely change the demographics. The number of people who "start" using pot under the age of 18 is staggering, and significantly higher than alcohol, so there may be some merit there.

However, the one thing we have all left out of this discussion is the "why". A kid does not take a drink or a hit to "escape" the first time, it is usually peer pressure. Continued use of drugs, for most, is the escape from reality, a reality that is not attractive. The greater the social decline, the more drugs will be desired, used and controlling of our society. If parents would spend more time with their kids instead of chasing the drug of money and consumerism, maybe drug use could be curtailed. A person who respects others and treats them with dignity does not desire nor pursue recreational drug use, legal or otherwise, because that person values others and their future.

[Irving]

However, the one thing we have all left out of this discussion is the "why". A kid does not take a drink or a hit to "escape" the first time, it is usually peer pressure. Continued use of drugs, for most, is the escape from reality, a reality that is not attractive. The greater the social decline, the more drugs will be desired, used and controlling of our society. If parents would spend more time with their kids instead of chasing the drug of money and consumerism, maybe drug use could be curtailed. A person who respects others and treats them with dignity does not desire nor pursue recreational drug use, legal or otherwise, because that person values others and their future.

Your responses are confusing and contradictory. I can't tell if you are for legalization, or against.

What I have quoted here, I agree with, but I don't see the part where it is the government's job to help our children make those correct decisions by throwing them into prison and turning them into criminals.

[MarkCO]

Your responses are confusing and contradictory. I can't tell if you are for legalization, or against.

What I have quoted here, I agree with, but I don't see the part where it is the government's job to help our children make those correct decisions by throwing them into prison and turning them into criminals.

The point is, you can not legislate morality...however a set of laws that portect innocnets form others choices is as far as government should go, but ours does not operate that way.

It is NOT the government's job to "raise" our children, it is the parent's job. TOO many Americans have subjugated their responsibility for their children to the schools, the government and day care workers!

What I am for has already passed. If pot were not criminalized in the first place, we would not have this problem. Can't unbreak an egg.

[xring]

So I take it you don't have kids...

For many, the "forbidden" IS the drive. Legalization, in total, probably won't change the total use, but it will likely change the demographics. The number of people who "start" using pot under the age of 18 is staggering, and significantly higher than alcohol, so there may be some merit there.

However, the one thing we have all left out of this discussion is the "why". A kid does not take a drink or a hit to "escape" the first time, it is usually peer pressure. Continued use of drugs, for most, is the escape from reality, a reality that is not attractive. The greater the social decline, the more drugs will be desired, used and controlling of our society. If parents would spend more time with their kids instead of chasing the drug of money and consumerism, maybe drug use could be curtailed. A person who respects others and treats them with dignity does not desire nor pursue recreational drug use, legal or otherwise, because that person values others and their future.

If what you are comunicating is condoning addiction and its root causes is not OK I agree with you. If what you are comunicating is its not OK for everyone to be stoned and not give a shit I agree with you. I think i understand your opposition to legalization of marijuana. It is indeed a complex problem. I dont have the answers only observations. It seems apparant to me that criminalization of drugs is perpetuating multi generational career criminals by allowing profit. It seems apparant to me that the "why" is not helped by incarceration. It seems apparant to me that the criminal justice resources we are using on this would be better allocated on violent offenders and the "why".

[MarkCO]

If what you are comunicating is condoning addiction and its root causes is not OK I agree with you. If what you are comunicating is its not OK for everyone to be stoned and not give a shit I agree with you. I think i understand your opposition to legalization of marijuana. It is indeed a complex problem. I dont have the answers only observations. It seems apparant to me that criminalization of drugs is perpetuating multi generational career criminals by allowing profit. It seems apparant to me that the "why" is not helped by incarceration. It seems apparant to me that the criminal justice resources we are using on this would be better allocated on violent offenders and the "why".

YES.

[Ronin13]

As I have stated earlier I believe marijuana to be a powerful drug with significant addiction risk. Marijuana is the drug of choice for about 8 out of 10 illicit drug users. It is my opinion that if marijuana was to be legalized a large percentage of users would be content with use of only legal drugs, just like many citizens are content to use only alcohol now. In my opinion there would be limited demand for the illegal "powerful, toxic designer drugs" you describe. Are 80% of illicit drug users going to abandon their drug of choice once it becomes legal and seek out illegal "powerful toxic designer drugs"? What I believe will happen if marijuana becomes legal is the majority of illicit marijuana users will have a strong incentive to use the only two legal drugs,marijuana and alcohol, shun criminal activities, and be overjoyed that they are no longer a criminal.

1;Its their drug of choice to begin with
2;They would not have to associate with the scumbag criminals to obtain it.
3;They would not face the risk of criminal prosecution .

The motivation is exactly the same that keeps the majority of citizens using the one legal drug available now, alcohol. In my opinion illicit drug use would strongly decline with the legalization of marijuana and the power and profits of the cartels along with it. The real question in my mind is whether legalization of marijuana and its subsequent addiction problems is worth the benefits of decriminalization of marijuana users. Imho the answer is overwhelminly yes, despite my distaste for potheads, or drunks for that matter.

I absolutely agree. Most people I know who use pot now have tried to go the "legitimate" route (I use the term loosely, much like Aloha said- they're going about it using lies that some doctors condone) and get their medical card. They have no real reason to need it other than they want to use it for recreational purposes, but have to lie to do so. I'm willing to bet about 80% of MMJ users have no legitimate excuse to get it "prescribed." If it's made all out legal, like alcohol, then I agree, they will probably only use it.

As far the drug war is concerned, if weed was legalized for rec. use then we would see a shift in what it smuggled across the border. It's already known in the drug world that the pot attained here in country is better than what is smuggled in from Mexico and other parts to the south, but the big issue will soon become coke and heroin, exclusively. It would be a blow to the cartels if you eliminate the demand for one drug coming from them.

[MarkCO]

SNIP... It would be a blow to the cartels if you eliminate the demand for one drug coming from them.

Meth is huge for the drug cartels, and they are now exploring designer drugs. There have been reports of Pot laced with designer drugs coming into the US from Mexico. If you are not scared of designer drugs, go read up on Bath Salts and Smiles and you will be. Legalization of pot won't affect the cartels long term, but it will increase the volume of more devastating drugs being pushed by the cartels.

[Rucker61]

. I'm willing to bet about 80% of MMJ users have no legitimate excuse to get it "prescribed."

From my research from medical and LEO friends, I think you're underestimating the number of recreational users. I've heard in the 95% range.