Hawaii False Alarm

[Zundfolge]

Why would martial law be instituted if NK fired a missile at the US? Especially if it wasn't a successful strike?

I guess I just disagree on the outcome you envision.

Martial law only happens if its a successful strike.

[Bailey Guns]

I don't mean to point at you spefically, especially since most of us here are just internet chlubs and it doesn't matter what we think, I just hope the military and government isn't taking any chances.

Sorry...I wasn't offended by what you said and didn't mean to sound that way. To expand a little... We were told how awesome and mighty Saddam's military was prior to Desert Storm and the Gulf War by talking heads and "experts", day in and day out. Military leaders were quietly saying "yes", he did have a substantial military capability but they were prepared for it. Turns out, he had a huge military capability...that was overwhelmed and slaughtered in a matter of hours by a much superior force we moved half way around the world.

NK seems to me to be similar. For a small country they have a massive military...with little capability to project it anywhere but within a relatively short distance from home. They don't have the logistics or supply capability to sustain that military for long in a war. Obviously, the threat to the south and to Japan will be far greater than it will be to the US mainland. Personally, I think "Rocket Man" wants a nuke more as a deterrent to a US first strike of any sort...even though that sounds a little ironic and backwards. He knows as long as he has that capability we'll be less likely to strike. He can't possibly believe he's going to win a nuclear exchange in any scenario...not even he's that delusional. He has to know that our response to a NK strike will be so overwhelming and devastating that little will be left of his country...even if it's just a massive conventional strike.

I know my first-hand knowledge is dangerously outdated. But when I was in I was in a position to know a bit more than some about the Soviet capability back during the cold war days. I'll be honest...what I heard about Soviet military capability from "experts" in the media and what I saw in my job were two completely different things.

[Bailey Guns]

Martial law only happens if its a successful strike.

Maybe localized...but I don't think it would be a nation-wide thing.

[Irving]

Desert Storm was exactly what I was thinking of actually. Much prefer to find out we over estimated than under estimated.

[Mtneer]

Would nuclear war be terrible? Absolutely, not dismissing that. Millions die. However, the "extinction" event wouldn't actually happen. Insofar as the world is concerned, it wouldn't even be a fart. Growing a third arm out of your back? More likely...


ETA/TLDR While I take nothing lightly, I do also understand that the vast majority of American's perception of nuclear war is quite wrong and premised on such crazy shit as the above.

Bigger concern than a hit on Denver is a detonation 300 miles over Kansas. The results of an EMP attack would dwarf any near ground blast, just a lot more slow motion.

[Gman]

Yeah, I take nothing lightly. And to some extent, we might be overconfident in the US.

Another surprise to most people: Nuclear winter doesn't exist. (Even if all the worlds nukes were launched).

...but...but....Climate Change! If people can unintentionally change the climate on the entire planet, just imagine what we could do if we intentionally did as much damage to Gaia as we possibly could?

Humans desperately seek significance in the universe. The 1980 eruption of Mount St. Helens - The total energy output, on May 18, was equivalent to 400 million tons of TNT - approximately 20,000 Hiroshima-size atomic bombs.

[Zundfolge]

Nuclear winter doesn't exist.

And Carl Sagen KNEW he was lying when he made it up too. His justification was basically; if lying to people about Nuclear Winter helped stave off Nuclear conflict, it would be worth it.

[Bailey Guns]

Scientists lying about computer models predicting effects on the atmosphere due to various reasons... That just sounds far-fetched to me.

[KevDen2005]

And Carl Sagen KNEW he was lying when he made it up too. His justification was basically; if lying to people about Nuclear Winter helped stave off Nuclear conflict, it would be worth it.

When you guys post stuff like that, if you have a source it would be awesome. I always need fuel with sources.

Also, Foxtrot, in addition to the already posted link, do you have some good sources on Nuclear attack effects and preventative measures for the citizen to protect themselves. I.e. iodine, how to take it, what protects against fallout, etc?

[zimagold]

FEMA NCR Key Response Planning Factors for the Aftermath of Nuclear Terrorism (2011)

http://www.fas.org/irp/agency/dhs/fema/ncr.pdf

Decent read based on modern simulation for small yield device. Zone effects would scale up for larger devices.