"Electric Vehicles are Actually Worse for the Environment than Internal Combustion Cars"

[Jer]

I've heard a few people complain about the lack of a grill. I wondered if it'd attract more buyers with a false grill like the crap they put on Mustangs. What do you think? I think even a grill that goes to just black plastic would be convincing enough.

The first generation of Model S had a fake black plastic nose cone. It's only purpose was to help with acceptance after focus groups said they preferred the fake grill. That's what ours looks like. The other is the newer generation called the "refresh" since the new front fascia was basically the only update. It's funny because non-EV people tend to prefer the gen 1 & EV people prefer the refresh version.

[Jer]

It would be nice if the front end was at least finished...in some way. Makes the boring Model 3 look even worse.

Personally I'm not a fan of the appearance of the Model 3.

[Jer]

Isn't that the tweet that Musk is most recently in trouble for?

No. My statement was about the Tesla announcement that literally just happened tonight that you can officially order the $35k version of the Model 3 & have it in your driveway in 2-4 weeks.

[Jer]

Indeed. Jer has also repeated the 7,000 vehicle per week number that was also walked back to 'by the end of the year'. I also read an assertion that the layoffs were assembly workers being replaced by further automation, yet Tesla stated that the layoffs were not assembly personnel.

...but somebody was on a roll.

What are you talking about?

[Aloha_Shooter]

And the bad news...16,000,000 tons of lithium known reserves on the planet earth. Largest known deposit is in Chile. Only known resource in the US is Nevada brine well. My guess is domestic production is 2000 tons a year. At least I know my fuel injected vehicles can run on 25% ethanol.

Reference link below for source:


https://minerals.usgs.gov/minerals/p...2018-lithi.pdf

So, EV's = 100% dependence on foreign energy with current technology. No thanks.

There's a reason Tesla bought one of the most advanced manufacturers of ultracapacitors. Li-Ion batteries are a "now" thing but they are looking past that. On the other hand, ultracapacitors will have their own complexities and issues.

0-60 in under 4 seconds isn't sporty enough for you?

My ideal EV right now would be a 10-year old electric Suzuki SX-4 AWD.

This one looks alright too:



This also doesn't suck:

0-60 is only a good measure of straight-line acceleration and using it as a metric of "goodness" presumes the car is also able to do other things that matter, like finishing the race without dropping into "limp home" mode. Fact of the matter is that Tesla can't finish the Nurburgring without falling into "limp home" mode. The battery flat-out overheats. Now, the fact of the matter is that I don't drive Nurburgring and very few people do. OTOH, it's a much closer analogy to real world driving than straight line quarter-mile segments.

https://forums.tesla.com/forum/forums/nurburgring

https://jalopnik.com/heres-what-a-te...rin-1600644908

https://insideevs.com/expected-tesla...l-power-video/



I know engineers who are also Porsche fans that flat-out believe EVs are the future, even for sports cars. I respect them and I agree. I also agree that that future EV may not be a Tesla and that EVs still have some significant hurdles to overcome to be practical solutions for everyday driving for a (diminishing but still significant) population of people.

[Jer]

There's a reason Tesla bought one of the most advanced manufacturers of ultracapacitors. Li-Ion batteries are a "now" thing but they are looking past that. On the other hand, ultracapacitors will have their own complexities and issues.






0-60 is only a good measure of straight-line acceleration and using it as a metric of "goodness" presumes the car is also able to do other things that matter, like finishing the race without dropping into "limp home" mode. Fact of the matter is that Tesla can't finish the Nurburgring without falling into "limp home" mode. The battery flat-out overheats. Now, the fact of the matter is that I don't drive Nurburgring and very few people do. OTOH, it's a much closer analogy to real world driving than straight line quarter-mile segments.

https://forums.tesla.com/forum/forums/nurburgring

https://jalopnik.com/heres-what-a-te...rin-1600644908

https://insideevs.com/expected-tesla...l-power-video/



I know engineers who are also Porsche fans that flat-out believe EVs are the future, even for sports cars. I respect them and I agree. I also agree that that future EV may not be a Tesla and that EVs still have some significant hurdles to overcome to be practical solutions for everyday driving for a (diminishing but still significant) population of people.

Good post & I agree on all counts.

I never said Tesla was the end all be all for every human being alive but it's damn good for 2019 & will suit a majority of the population just fine.

I spend so much of my time refuting false information that it makes me look like Tesla can do no wrong in my eyes which isn't the case.

I've said numerous times now that competition needs to hurry & step to the plate because if Tesla gets too far ahead they won't be able to compete & then all of us consumers are screwed.

[Irving]

It is insanely stupid for manufacturers to try and have proprietary charging systems.

[skoodge]

No. My statement was about the Tesla announcement that literally just happened tonight that you can officially order the $35k version of the Model 3 & have it in your driveway in 2-4 weeks.

What are you talking about?

https://www.wired.com/story/elon-mus...mpt-court-sec/

[brutal]

No. My statement was about the Tesla announcement that literally just happened tonight that you can officially order the $35k version of the Model 3 & have it in your driveway in 2-4 weeks.

I read June.

[Irving]

I read June.

So sooner than a Form 4 or a 1919 mount?