*CONFIRMED SEE PAGE 7* Littleton PD Requesting online-uploads of video for firearms transactions

[electronman1729]

So with camera, how is the power consumption metered so you can bill Littleton? Do you also bill Littleton for your time for setting this up and working with them?

[BPTactical]

Understandable for pawnbroker operations, not for FTF Xfers or OTC sales though.

[battle_sight_zero]

Understandable for pawnbroker operations, not for FTF Xfers or OTC sales though.

Agreed. I wonder how Triple J is working with this. They do consignments. Be interested to see what anyone finds out. As for this camera company how are they compensated? I will not be surprised if this spreads to other Denver metro cities. I would not be surprised that a certain segment of a political party is pushing this to see how it goes as a test of the waters. Just to be clear so far this is for transfers from person to person and consignment turn ins. Basically if you put your firearm on consignment you are expected to complete the extra form, your firearm description and serial number logged and provided to the so called service, you are then photographed, your driver license photographed, and then fingerprinted. If you trade with someone both of you would do the same on top of the regular background check and transfer procedures. To top it off they are requiring the FFL to hold the firearm for 30 days before placing it for sale. So many ways this letter could interpreted, so if you trade you could have to wait 30 days to do so. Hope it gets trashed. Its nonsense.

[Brass]

The letter seems to ask the gun shop to implement this system. It doesn't say it's a requirement, does it?

[tactical_2012]

I could see how this would apply if you put your Firearm on consignment as it is the samething as selling to a pawn shop but for ftf private transfer doesn't seem right

[Great-Kazoo]

I could see how this would apply if you put your Firearm on consignment as it is the same thing as selling to a pawn shop but for ftf private transfer doesn't seem right

That's never stopped a .gov entity before.

[jslo]

Agreed. I wonder how Triple J is working with this. They do consignments. Be interested to see what anyone finds out. As for this camera company how are they compensated? I will not be surprised if this spreads to other Denver metro cities. I would not be surprised that a certain segment of a political party is pushing this to see how it goes as a test of the waters. Just to be clear so far this is for transfers from person to person and consignment turn ins. Basically if you put your firearm on consignment you are expected to complete the extra form, your firearm description and serial number logged and provided to the so called service, you are then photographed, your driver license photographed, and then fingerprinted. If you trade with someone both of you would do the same on top of the regular background check and transfer procedures. To top it off they are requiring the FFL to hold the firearm for 30 days before placing it for sale. So many ways this letter could interpreted, so if you trade you could have to wait 30 days to do so. Hope it gets trashed. Its nonsense.

Believe Triple J, is technically, in Centennial

[Skip]

Appears optional.
Or did I miss something?

Yup. Littleton PD can implement whatever they'd like. Doesn't give them license to compel businesses to implement the same.

But like I said, all things considered, if I were an FFL this would be strong signal to close up shop. There is probably a very strong anti-gun sentiment behind the extension by fiat of something meant for pawnshops.

I asked previously what the policy benefit here could possible be. 90+% of my business with RFB was out of state transfers so their cameras would never record the seller. Only the FFL and I would be recorded. How does that aid in the investigation of stolen property? All they'd have is the dealer book, cameras or sans cameras.

FFLs stated it was presented as not optional.

Pretty stupid decision to accept this, IMHO.

There are only two reasonable options...

1. Close
2. Tell PD to eff off and deal with the consequences


I doubt any of those FFLs staying in business and accepting this consulted an attorney to understand all the reasons this is a horrible decision.

[tactical_2012]

Spoke to a LE friend who helped clarify this. So when a private seller takes his firearm to an FFL to do a private transfer the transfer is actually a 3 way transfer the gun goes from the seller, then goes on the books with the FFL, and then the FFL transfers the gun to the buyer. So required as a business taking in the gun they are required to do the same process as if you were consigning, pawning, or selling the gun to them. The seller is the only one that has to submit to the questionnaire, finger print, and photo NOT the buyer. The reason is when you do the FFL transfer CBI does not clear the serial number on the weapon being sold. There was incident in which a local gun shop took a weapon on consignment and sold it to a private individual that individual was a Legal CCW holder and had LE contact in another state. When his weapon serial number was cleared it came back as stolen as it was a stolen weapon when it was consigned and never cleared before being sold.

I as a buyer am shocked to find out that even doing private ffl transfers CBI does t clear the serial number to check if it is stolen.

[sroz]

Serial number is not included in the submission to CBI. They never see it.