What Am I Missing? - Israel and Hamas (Palestinians)

[Mick-Boy]

The United States needs to pick a side, warts and all, and support that side exclusively. I'd prefer that choice be Israel for a number of reasons, mostly that little freedom thing.

Freedom for who?

Pick a side based on whose interests? If we're talking about ours (and ours are the ones I care about) then the US has well over a quarter of a million of it's citizens deployed to countries in the muslim world. A significant percentage or our oil comes from arab countries. What does Israel bring to the table for us?

Again though, things just aren't as simple as "pick a side and support it exclusively". The United States has vested national interest in promoting peace in the middle east. The only real way that's going to happen is a two state solution. So pick a side just isn't going to cut it.

[roberth]

Freedom for who?.

LOL, you think Arab countries provide the same freedoms as Israel. Now who needs to do some research.

Pick a side based on whose interests? If we're talking about ours (and ours are the ones I care about) then the US has well over a quarter of a million of it's citizens deployed to countries in the muslim world. A significant percentage or our oil comes from arab countries. What does Israel bring to the table for us?

Again though, things just aren't as simple as "pick a side and support it exclusively". The United States has vested national interest in promoting peace in the middle east. The only real way that's going to happen is a two state solution. So pick a side just isn't going to cut it.

We aren't talking about the other Arab countries, we're talking about the Palestinians.

Exports from Israel to U.S. With a population of 7.1 million, Israel exported US$20.8 billion worth of merchandise to the United States in 2007, an 8.6% increase from 2006 and up by 63% in 4 years. The following product categories represent about 77% of Israeli exports to America.

1. Gem diamonds … US$9.5 billion – up 10.5% from 2006 (45.6% of Israel-to-U.S. exports)
2. Dental, medical and pharmaceutical preparations … $2.7 billion – up 3.5% (12.9%)
3. Telecommunications equipment … $746.8 million – up 17.6% (3.6%)
4. Complete civilian aircraft … $685.9 million – up 41.6% (3.3%)
5. Other hospital, medical and scientific equipment … $655 million – up 12.6% (3.1%)
6. Electric apparatus and parts … $385.6 billion – up 11.3% (1.9%)
7. Civilian aircraft engines … $370.5 million – up 52.6% (1.8%)
8. Measuring, testing and control instruments … $337.1 million – down 9.8% (1.6%)
9. Other military equipment … $271.3 million – up 223.2% (1.3%)
10. Computer accessories, peripherals and parts … $254.6 billion – up 36.5% (1.2%).

http://daniel-workman.suite101.com/top-israeli-imports-exports-a59994

Palestinian Exporting to the United States

Palestinian exports are low compared to imports; however, the numbers have been increasing gradually in the recent years. According to the Palestinian Central Bureau of Statistics (PCBS) total exports from Palestine in the year 1996 reached $339.5 million and the number has increased gradually to reach $513 million in the year 2007, with the exception of the year 2000, where exports reached $400.8 million. The products recording the most exporting rates include; non-metallic mineral manufactures, furniture, footwear, iron and steel, medicinal and pharmaceutical products, and cork and wood products (excluding furniture) with combined exports that reach $242 million in the year 2007 (47% of total exports in that year).
Exporting to the United States is very low compared to exporting to other countries in the world, as total exports to the United States throughout the years 1996-2007 reached the total of $14.5 million (less than 1% of total exports in those years) according to PCBS, showing gradual increase in recent years. The year 2005 has seen the highest export numbers to the United States with $4.2 million of exported products.

http://www.pal-am.com/etemplate.php?id=201

[Mick-Boy]

LOL, you think Arab countries provide the same freedoms as Israel. Now who needs to do some research.

Do you think Arabs in Israel enjoy what you or I would call freedom?

[roberth]

Do you think Arabs in Israel enjoy what you or I would call freedom?

I don't know, I haven't been to Israel.

I did find this.

http://www.middle-east-info.org/gate...rael/index.htm

[Ronin13]

I like how no one addressed what I said... must have been pretty true stuff.

The entire Palestine vs Israel match is pretty old and tired. Israel is very accepting to a peaceful solution, but it just seems too many factions aligned with Palestine are hell bent on destroying the Jews entirely. I side with Israel, I have friends who live there, were born there, and currently serve in their armed forces.

[Mick-Boy]

The entire Palestine vs Israel match is pretty old and tired.

How true.

Israel is very accepting to a peaceful solution, but it just seems too many factions aligned with Palestine are hell bent on destroying the Jews entirely.

Correction. Israel SAYS they would be accepting to a peaceful solution. However their actions don't bear that out.

The extreme factions on both sides are an issue and will likely always be an issue (it's hard to argue with someone when "god says" they're right) but they don't come close to the "big issue".

There are really three "big" issues preventing a sustainable peace between Israel and Palestine.

1. Jerusalem
2. Settlers in the West Bank
3. The right of return for Palestinian refugees.

To speak intelligently about these issues will require getting into a bit of history so bare with me.

JERUSALEM-Under UN resolution 181 (Nov 29, 1947) Jerusalem was supposed to be directly administered by the UN. The British (being the governing power) were responsible to implement the plan. The fear of backlash to British interests from the Arab World caused them to resign their mandate over Palestine and withdraw. Jordan (then called Trans-Jordan) took the opportunity to cross the Jordan river and invade what was supposed to be the "Arab State". They took the West Bank and Jerusalem in Heavy fighting with the Haganah. By the time an armistice was reached in 1949 the city was divided in two. West Jerusalem was controlled by the Israelis. East Jerusalem by Trans-Jordan. It remained that way until the 1967 war (also called the Six-Day War). On June 7 Mordechi Gur's 55th Paratrooper entered and held the Old City of Jerusalem. From that point on the city has been controlled and administered by the Israelis (with the exception of the Temple Mount, where the al-Aqsa Mosque (Dome of the Rock) is controlled by a muslim waqf). In 1980 Israel passed a law (The Jerusalem Law) declaring Jerusalem "Whole and united" as the capital of Israel. The UN Security Counsel passed a vote (14-0 with the US abstaining) immediately afterwards for the Israelis to withdraw the Law. The Palestinians have also declared that the capital of the Palestinian State is to be in East Jerusalem. That was the major stumbling block between Ehud Barak and Yasser Arafat at the 2000 Camp David Summit.

Israel has alternately offered and refused to give over control of East Jerusalem depending on the Prime Minister. Any time the topic of dividing Israel comes up it's met with fierce opposition from both Right-wing Orthodox Jews and Christian-Zionists One more issue of late is the fact that Israel is even now building more apartment blocks for Israelis in East Jerusalem despite Prime Minister Olmert saying at the Annapolis conference (Nov '07) that Israel would cease all settlement activity in the West Bank (Israel's position is that East Jerusalem is not part of the West Bank). The Palestinian position was stated By Arafat at the 2000 Camp David Summit "the Arab leader who would surrender Jerusalem is not born yet".

SETTLEMENTS-Search "Israeli Settlement" and do some reading. This issue has a possible solution that has been proposed and accepted by both sides a couple of times. Basically the Israeli Government will assess the area the settlements occupy (approx. 5% of the West Bank) and give an equal amount of land to the Palestinian Government. The Israeli far right wing sees this as unacceptable and has gone so far as to claim all the land to the Jordan River. Some Palestinian's oppose this because they feel it legitimizes Israelis "stealing" their land.

RIGHT OF RETURN-At this point there are something on the order of 4 million Palestinian "refugees" outside the borders of Israel and Palestine. These are people or the children/grandchildren of people who left their homes in what is now the State of Israel and the Palestinian Territory. The Palestinian people claim they have the right to return to their original land or homes based on UN General Assembly Resolution 3236. The Israelis adamantly refuse and see this as tantamount to national suicide. The Israelis argue that Israel was created as a Democratic Jewish State and allowing the right of return would change the demographic so drastically that the population would be over 40% Arab. Thus destroying any identity of a Jewish State. The proposed solution is to offer displaced Palestinians the right to return to what will likely become the Palestinian State or offer them compensation.

Obviously there are many more, smaller issues in addition to these three. The whole process is complicated by Hard-liners on both sides who refuse to compromise what they see as their "god given" right to the land. I could link a half dozen recent articles showing the actions of both sides undercutting the peace process but if you read the Jerusalem Post (www.jpost.com) and the news put out by the Palestinian Media Center (www.palestine-pmc.com) even for a short time you can see some shining examples for yourself.